16th ave.

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"Give Us What They Got." , Whoopi Goldberg on health care in the U.S.

Dadu2004

Dear Anti-Vaccination Crazies -

We expect an apology for both blatantly and no-so-blatantly telling us that we're killing our children by giving them vaccines.

Best Regards,

Sane parents of the world who want to keep their kids from getting sick.

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16th ave.

just realized exactly what that guy did. hadn't even read through it much. only posted it to for others who probably hadn't seen it since it is about autism and vaccines.

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"Give Us What They Got." , Whoopi Goldberg on health care in the U.S.

ElliottCarasDad

from the article...
WTF kind of study is that?
How did that fear-monger even get that published?
jeeesh

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Jeremy+3

Two words, stupid people

bssage

The way I understand this as related by MD's I have discussed it with

Thats what he did. That was his job. and those were his patients. Who was he supposed to study.

This was a observation of the study. By noting measles, mumps, and rubella bateria were present in the patients studied. The study did not claim a link only that his findings might warrant further trials

After his research was halted he needed a control group. The children or their parents could have just not participated.

After threat of legal recourse and being strung up in the media as the author was

These people had exhausted all other avenues of relief. He was willing to do something. The way i understand it.

I am a PRO Immunization person. But I feel this entire debacle was driven by a press that is playing both sides of the fence. They are the ones who layed out the original interpretations of the report. We have been seeing them daily on the Today show, Good Morning America. Larry King. And now they want to lay the blame soley on his feet.

Am I the only one saying what the HLL. Is there no accountability in reporting whatsoever?? And we have to be careful. If we read something in the news. That alone does not make it "the whole story" They are paid to write headlines. IMHO the press deserves the lions share of the blame for this. The reason we are facing a return of these sicknesses is not because of one very small uncontrolled study. But because it was presented to the general public in a way that shook our core beliefs. They had people believing they were harming their own children.

Which one of us have actually read the report?? What happens when fear takes hold of people making observations? Should he have not written his observations at all?? Its a slippery slope.

IMHO

And I should say this. My initial reaction was the same as the majority. Until I discussed it with a couple of doctors and they took the time to explain it to me. I originally had the same opinion as you all (my peeps)

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Jeremy+3

Do you really think the press are the ones who set out the original interpretation of the report? Maybe people outside of the EU is ignorant to science, but you will be hard pushed to find someone who doesn't read medical studies, but you will be hard pushed to someone who actually believes the press.

bssage

Ok

Have you read the report??

Tell me then where in the report it says immunizations are responsible for Autism.

Show me a study that states MMR can not be one of many possible triggers.

Tell you what. Because I have only read excerpts from the report and would imagine I would have difficulty reading something like that in it entirety. Let me know what your conclusions are when your finished.

IMHO at this time the doctor reported his findings. He did not represent his study as a true "Controlled" study. Nor as a "double blind" study. Which is the gold standard of studies.

As I understand it the people who participated in the original study had two choices. Further testing. Or saying its over, and institutionalizing their children. I know what I would have done. What would you do?

Right or wrong. You apparently have much more faith in the press than I do.

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Jeremy+3

So by not believing anything the press says I have faith in the press...

Of course I have read the report, I don't know anyone in 'real life' (not internet folk) who haven't read the report apart from children.

In his paper Lancet states that bowel inflammation and generally ill health is associated with autism (neuropsychi-atric dysfunction being the correct term) (which is true in certain causes of autism), he then went on to state that the cause of bowel in health in the 12 children was caused by the MMR, which then developed in autism.
Lancet stated that the bowel problem most commonly develops due to environmental effects, where he suggested the sole environmental influence was that of the MMR vaccine. You should be able to find the article on google scholar or web of science.

The people in the study did not have those choices, they had the choice of carrying on the study, or pulling out the study, there was no threatened institutionalisation, especially as anyone under 16 can only be placed in a children's mental health until with permission from both legal parents, it must also be done with the consent of two GP's and one psychologist, Lancet and his colleagues were neither.

C.P Farrington is quite a good paper showing that MMR does not cause/trigger autism, but you would have to pay to view it, I'll get another study I know that you can free online without cost, it is a fairly short paper.
http://www.morrisonlucas.com/GL/vacc...o_evidence.pdf

bssage

Two things.

The first is that you and your peers clearly are more advanced the me and mine. If you guys are reading this stuff on a regular basis. Well I wont be getting in agruments with you-all. My friends and myself would be more likely caught reading the Video game Adviser than this stuff.

I found it and read it. Along with many of the details of the case. These are quotes from the actual report.

And yes I highlighted the parts I am using to make my case.

As I understand it. Most of the issue is that while not recommending children go without getting vaccinated. He did recommend that the vaccines were given separately and not all three together. The problem with this is that they are made together and that new vaccines would have to be developed individually to accomplish this. He stood to profit from the individual vaccines and thus had a vested interest in the direction of the report since he was in the process of making the new vaccines (at least one of them).

You need to point out to me where he recommended against vaccinating children. I'm not trying to be a smart a$$. I was just unable to find it. If that is the case and it states somewhere in the report that he advises not to get vaccinated. Then I stand corrected and will say I was wrong.

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