freezieframe

I'm new to this forum, and I need advice! I have an almost 21 y/o daughter. she lives with a g/f in an apt about 20 mi from dad and me. she goes to school p/t and works p/t as a personal trainer in a gym. she pays her own rent/utilities/most of groceries. we pay college, car and health ins, cell phone, car registration. she knows if she needs help, we are here. she went away to college for 1 yr, but came home and decided to go the jr college into 4 yr college route. she doesn't really care for school, but has always promised she would finish her degree, even if she only took 1 or 2 classes at a time, and we are fine with that. she has about 56 hrs and is about 3 classes short of the 2 yr degree. sounds good so far, right?

Last wk she told us of her new b/f, he is 34 y/o with 3 children. she met him at work, and has been seeing him on/off for about 6 mo, even though his ex g/f of 1 yr just moved out 3 wks ago. during this time, she talked of this man, and his attentions toward her, ie calls, text, etc. she led us to believe that she had NO interest in him, and she took occasional calls from him b/c he was upper mgmt, and it just made the workplace more bearable. we advised her to keep things professional, and pointed out his lack of character, since he had a live in g/f the whole time. we told her what he was doing was a form of sexual harrassment, and if it continued she needed to go to someone above him, or just find another job. during the mo of december, she was very unhappy with her job, and she asked to be xferred to another location, and mgmt agreed, and there was mention of charges being filed. she said she didn't want to go that way, especially since mgmt agreed to xfer her to another location. instead of xferring her, mgmt xferred HIM, and we thought everything was fine. then she drops this new information on us. after the initial shock, we have tried to talk with her about the negatives of this situation. he is too old, his(AND her) lack of character regarding the g/f, the 3 children, 1 of whom the ex just found out about in december, etc. we even tried to approach it from the direction of should this relationship last, how would she feel about not having her own kids, since he's had a vasectomy? in hindsight, we now see how he has been manipulating her, she has already broken ties with most of her friends. when we would ask why she wasn't hanging out with so-and-so, she would use the excuse that all they wanted to do was get drunk and she didn't.....we knew she wasn't dating, but she had a high school romance that she still struggled with, so we let that go too. she has been very distant to me in the last 3 wks, but I thought it still had something to do with the job situation. this guy showered her with gifts and cards for valentines day, with 1 of them saying he loved her. she came by for about 2 hrs this wk, and he called and sent text about 10 times, even though she talked to him while she was here. when I told her just how obsessive that behavior was, she said she likes her b/f to be that way. her room mate says he is constantly calling, or is at the apt, or she is at his apt. when her room mate tried to talk to her about it, she turned her phone off and didn't come home that night. he was slowly bringing his clothes to her apt and staying there, but since her rommate has been voicing her opinion, she tends to go to his apt. he was trying to get her to move in with him; she said no, but I don't think that will last. her lease is up in 1 mo, and she and her roommate are on a waiting list for another apt. I offered for them to move here with us until the apt came open(we have a lg home and they would have the whole upstairs), but she said no. last wkend her dad had tix to car races(she loves them), but she wouldn't go. she won't go with us to visit her sister and hubby and baby tomorrow. now she doesn't see the need to go to school anymore, she has been missing class. she is pulling further and further away from everyone. my friend's daughter married a guy like this, but she left him after 4 mo. she couldn't take the obsessive controlling. but that situation was a little different, in that they were the same age. we are out of our minds with worry, but don't know what to say/do/how to react, etc. we know we need to stay in her life, but how? I feel like I need to be on dr phil!! please, if anyone has ANY advice, it will be so appreciated!!

jmeyer3131

My heart goes out to you. I wish I had some better advice, but in the end it will all be her decision. This guy is doing everything to control her and to get her away from everybody but him, and she's falling for it.

You've done all the right things in pointing out character flaws. She has made it clear that she doesnt' care. From now on you might have to do your best to accept the relationship. Start having her invite him over. When she's with you, have her talk about what she likes about him and share that stuff with her. When she sees you are really trying, it might help her feel closer to you.

That's important, because he will do his best to take her away from you. And after awhile, if she finds you easy to talk to about him, she may be able to bring up her worries, too. She needs to feel able to talk to you without you trying to discourage her from being with him, as hard as that is.

In the end, the goal has to be to not let him take her away from you. Show all the love and understanding you can. She knows you don't like him, so start by explaining that it's hard to care for somebody who had once hurt her because you love her so much, but that it's obvious he is important to her. Since he is, you will do your best to accept him.

It's the only thing I can think of. I can't stress how important it is to help her feel free to talk to you. You don't have to agree with things she says, but just try to understand how she feels. Otherwise she'll end up completely isolated and completely dependent on him.

__________________
Janet
www.CanIChangeALife.blogspot.com

freezieframe

thanks janet, I really appreciate your insight. I know I need to be there for her, but right now she won't let anyone around but him. after our initial conversation with her, I called her later and asked if the 4 of us could sit down and try to make peace, so we can be a family. she said no, b/c we already have our opinion of him. well, SHE is the one that formed our opinion - we haven't even met him...my last conversation(wed) was about income tax and the apt, I didn't try to talk about this. I know the more I push one way, the more she will pull the other.

her dad had a medical procedure yesterday(fri). she called thurs nite to say she was coming to see him fri when we got home. she called while we were at the surgery center, and I told her dad hadn't been released, and we would call when he was. dad called her, but she never called back. this morning(sat) her room mate called to see if we'd heard from her, b/c she hasn't been home, and won't ans her phone. I didn't call her, I feel she will talk when she wants to. I love her so much, and this hurts so badly b/c we have always been very close. we talked every day, even when she was away at college for a yr. she was very good about keeping in touch, and would complain if I didn't call her!! and she has told me some pretty crazy things that some parents might not listen to, so I've always felt the lines of communication were open. even when we didn't agree, and TRUST ME, that happened alot, we still talked(and cried) things out. that's why this is so unbelievable, as she has been seeing him on/off and kept it secret. it's kinda like she knows it's not quite right, but still wants to test the waters... she is a psyc major, and has 5 or 6 classes behind her that deal with behavior, and she seems to see all the problems in other ppl's situations. I guess you never see them in your own. so I will call her once a wk or so and leave a msg. maybe she will call back, but even if she doesn't at least she knows I'm here if she needs me. and I am looking in to some group counseling for myself, so I can get a grip on my own emotions. in the meantime, I don't know what I'm going to do with dad....he's a wreck, this is his baby girl. I'm almost as worried for him as I am for her!! but you know what? what doesn't kill you will make you stronger.....thanks so much for listening, and please pray for my family...


"choices".......

SageMother

There are some situations that peple must live through to appreciate who they are deep inside.

It might be best for you to avoid addressing this issue withher and simply stick to those things that are more bearable.....

The rejection of the relationship by her room mate and her family are making it easier for this fellow to gain unfettered access to her state of mind. The more people reject her relationship, the further she will remove herself from that rejection, regardless of what is going on with the boyfriend. She apparently had already expressed her disatisfaction with school. He didn't really need to influence her too much for her to grow weary of living up to the desires of others in that area.

Even though this fellows way of dealing with life doesn't resemble the ideal, it could very well be that your daughter is not being influenced by him as much as she is choosing to make changes based on her emotional needs.

Please reconsider your approach. It appears to me, that she has been doing alot of things based on the desires of others. Maybe it is time to just love her, and avoid trying to convince her that her judgments about her life are not acceptable. If I had conversation with my parents like those you have described, I would feel rejected.

freezieframe

thanks so much sage mother, for your advice. I'm sure she has felt rejected by us at some point, and that is part of the reason I've decided to seek counseling, because I feel I have to learn to be more accepting of behavior that might not follow 'normal' rules, b/c there is no 'normal'. I've always known that love shouldn't come with conditions, and perhaps we were unwittingly placing them on her. It's amazing how a family crisis can bring out your flaws, and help you work on them. In the meantime, she called today and came to see her dad. we didn't talk about the situation, we just wanted to visit. when she didn't feel pressured, she started talking about him and his family, kids, etc. she told us how everything started between them, during the summer, when another co-worker asked for her # and he told the guy to back off. when she asked why he did that, he told her it was his job to protect her, and he would make sure she didn't date 'losers'. their relationship started shortly after that, and since her job schedule kept them together alot, she was always with him. in the beginning, him, her, and the g/f worked at the same location, but in sept he had g/f xferred. she's not sure if his g/f ever found out about them. the problem during dec was b/c he was going to propose to his g/f and she didn't want to be the 'other woman' when he married. he was only proposing to his g/f b/c he wanted to gain custody of his boys, and felt it would be easier if he were married. she tried to xfer, but he refused to agree to it. so she started being late, etc, trying to get fired. he saved her job, so she must be more important to him that the g/f. mgmt xferred him in early feb b/c they noticed his behavior toward my daughter, and felt it was bordering on harrassment. he was interrupting her training sessions and clients were complaining, he had the evening sign out sheets moved to his office so he would know when she left, he would drop in on her conversations with other mgrs, etc. the g/f broke up with him in jan, then left the company when mgmt xferred him to her location. that's when he realized he didn't ever really love his g/f, he really loves my daughter, and wants to get married b/c they are soul mates, etc. for the moment, he doesn't want anyone in the company to know about their relationship, b/c he feels ppl would 'frown' on it, since the ex just moved out. during this conversation, my hubby got up and left, I found him upstairs crying. I just listened, and made few comments b/c that's what jmeyer felt was best. when she finished with her story, she told me how glad she was that dad and I had talked with her last wk and pointed out things that she hadn't seen, and she has decided to slow this down a bit, b/c she feels he is trying to move too fast. she also said she was attracted to him partly b/c she felt he was older and more mature, and wouldn't want to play the games younger guys play, but in talking about things today, she saw that he played a game with the ex...while I find the whole story very disturbing, I'm just glad she talked, as she's always done in the past. she has patched up her friendship with her room mate, they have agreed there is nothing they can't deal with. and she did go to school on fri, she knows she is only a few classes from 2 yr degree, and would like to get it done this summer and go into the 4 yr university. she had talked with one of her clients, who encouraged her to stay in school. I know we will get thru this, but I'm not too sure about my husband....it's really hard for dads to let their little girls go...

thanks so much for listening, and please keep us in your prayers...

jmeyer3131

This is an extremely scary guy. I'm glad you're getting counseling. I hope that the counselor can help you to know the right things to do and say.

I'm glad you were able to just listen for now. That way she knows she can come back to you with all her concerns. This guy is extremely controlling. All sorts of alarms go off as I read your post. Even the folks he works for saw problems. He's not doing all this stuff out of caring; he's way too controlling to actually love somebody.

Telling your daughter that he was going to prevent her from dating losers is pretty creepy. Everything about him is creepy. I don't think your problem or your husband's is in letting go; it's in letting go to this guy.

It's a fine line when you talk to her. I hope the counselor can help you find a way to help your daughter discover that this behavior is totally inappropriate without being critical of him, because then she'll just stop seeing you. Love helps a person grow, it doesn't control like he's doing.

Please keep us posted, and I will most definitely keep you in my prayers.

__________________
Janet
www.CanIChangeALife.blogspot.com

SageMother

I am so very relieved that you were able to get together with your daughter. She will need you in the months to come. You are showing strength and wisdom in keeping the lines of communication open even when it is difficult. I will keep you in my thoughts when I burn my evening candles.

freezieframe

thanks so much for listening and replying, it really helps alot. I called around today, and I've found a group counseling session for thurs nite(dang, I have to miss grey's anatomy!!). she called today, but I missed her call. I'm much calmer than I was, just seeing her and letting her talk made me feel so much better, b/c even though it IS scary to listen to, if she talks enough, she will hear what she's saying and realize it's a little crazy. at least that's what I'm hoping for. hubby's not too good with it just yet, but he cried for 3 mos BEFORE she left for college....lol he has 2 children from his previous marriage, and is really close with his son, but not his other daughter. that's another crisis story in the family, and we lived thru that one, so we'll live thru this too.

once again, I so appreciate the advice, and the shoulder. I will keep you posted.....

newdad06

When I was 21, I knew enough to listen to my parents, but it didn't mean I was going to listen. I was ready to make my own mistakes. Your daughter is listening to you and everyone else that has said this guy isn't right for her. But, she wants to be right and will continue with this until she can no longer hide the facts from herself. Everyone else can see that no good will come from this relationship, but she has dug in and wants to see it through. I know it hurts to watch her make a big mistake, but you need to accept that you've stated how you feel and made your position clear. Now is the time to focus on any other aspect of your relationship with her than this. She will push all obstacles from her path, until she has seen this thing through. If you keep voicing your disaproval you only become an obstacle.

Your doing great keeping the communication going, stay that course and keep your opinions about the guy quiet. She has heard them. She knows and she will remember when the time comes.

Best wishes...

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Step Family Talk

mamab

I have to agree with newdad. I remember being in a relationship or two that my parents weren't thrilled about. But, I had to have my way, until I was hurt in the end. I know you don't want to see your daughter go through that, but some things we just have to learn the hard way.

Just let her know that you love her, you're there if she wants to talk, and that she's always welcome home. I pray that things work out okay.