Punishment

[Hartz75]

I have always had a hard time with my eldest daughter since she was 1 year. She is now going to be 7. I have taken her to doctor after doctor after doctor, she is very good at acting well behaved for the 10 minute appointment where the doctors tell me "she is too pretty to act that way" yes a pediatritian told me that

Anyways I have tried 1.2.3 magic and it works for some of the smaller things (stuff I call regular child behavouir). I have used writting lines as well, and the corner. But she has these massive melt downs where she goes wild, scream like there is an ax murderer after her. I have tried everything I can think of.
I have recently started to ignor her while she is freaking out (suggestion from some friends) I have only been doing for 1 week but she does not like it at all. So I guess that is a good thing. If she calms down I will talk to her but as long as she remains calm and talks nice (her attitidue is very nasty lately)

My friends think I should not take her on the family vacation. what do you think?? They say they have done it in the past for day trips, the "bad" child was left with a sitter and the siblings were allowed to go. Like the Zoo, or going to a play ground.

It breaks my heart to consider this, I could maybe for a day trip but we were going to go away for 3 days in July.

[IADad]

hmmmm, seems a little harsh, but then again, you haven't given much specifics about what exactly she's been doing, who you'd entrust her with, what the alternatives are etc.

It seems like you have an approach that may be starting to work. It also seems like just rather randomly banning her from the family for sins of the past is only going to alienate her. While your "ignore her tantrums" method is showing progress, I think I'd remain consist and stay with it for a while, show her that she can get better results being a reasonable person than a "reactor."

i guess I'd plan to take her on vacation, and I'd also plan on personally being prepared to sit out something special as a part of it if she acts out and needs to spend quiet time during the vacation. In short, a few hours be being deprived of some family fun, not leanving her behind.

[Hartz75]

I was thinking it seemed harsh too. I can understand a day trip planned and she acted up that day then yes she can be left behind. She would be left with one of 4 people. My inhome daycare down the street, my babysitter down the street, my sister, or my father.

What she is doing is huge meltdowns for no reason. (I say she has the Dr jekle Mr Hyde look) I could go on for pages but I will try an example.

This morn, she was fine got ready for school then it was time to go, so the girls go downstairs to put there shoes on, she does, but then she give me that blank look that seems like I have lost her "mentally" and she sits rips her shoes off and starts scratching herself (not hard, this is a common thing she has done this since she was 2) I call it the itchies. She crys and crys, you would think her skin is on fire. I use to offer help, try to talk to her, try to comfort her, but I get hit, yelled at, kicked, get given dirty looks ect ect. I have spent many a night crying over these.

Now I have started ignoring it, I ask her do you want me to help you? and What would you like me to do? She screamed NO at me, so I just continued to put the bags in the van to go. She freaks and screams, I ignor her, and went to pick up her school bag, she hits me away. I ignor her and tell her that her school bag is now her job. She demands that I pick it up, but I ignor her. Put her little sister in the van. She realizes I am not kiding and she grabs her bag crying and begging me for a hug. I ignor her and tell her to get in the van. I remain calm no yelling. She screams and screams the whole way to day care. she calms while I pull into the driveway, I tell her she acted inappropriatly and her school bag is now her job, and she had to do a time out at day care for 10 minutes.

I have more examples but I have to run...

[IADad]

Hhmmm, I have a couple of followup thoughts. Her meltdowns seem exteremely, well, extreme. On the one hand I'd wonder if there's a mental/developmental issue that a doctor should look at, but the fact that she seems to know to turn it off make me wonder. About all I can think of to suggest, if you want someone to evaluate, is to secretly tape and show somebody that.

How does she do at school? Do her teachers, counselor etc have anything to suggest? The scratching really makes me wonder. I really think I'd talk to a psychiatrist (either at school or private) and discuss her symptoms, and at least get someone to say they do or don't want to see her for it.


It's interesting that you seemed to get such marked results with your ignoring tactic. That really makes it seem like an attention issue. Did this go own before

[Antoinette]

even if she has a melt down/tantrum/whatever it is; stick at one form of punishment i am a childcare worker and a mother of two.. and at work i get up to 10 children all on my own to look after who are aged between 3-5 and there are children who run/scream/bite/hit/throw sand etc just because you disrupt there play and call them in for lunch... we do the "sit and watch" method which is pretty much time out but they get to watch the other children play and then after the time designated (one minute for each year of age) and the time doesn't start until they are sitting quietly... it really works and they really do get the message eventually.. every time they get up you just have to sit them back town and start the timing again.. and keep telling them that you are re setting the time and why your doing it... i love this method i will use it on my kids as apposed to hitting.

[kdryan]

You know, I love it when I am in Wal-Mart or something like that and a kid is just screaming his head off throwing some kind of tantrum, then you look at the parents and they are just ignoring it while people all around are looking like they should do something. Tantrums are attention seeking behavior, and once one begins, any action you take to try to stop them is only going to reward the behavior. You just sit back, ride it out and once the kid sees they do not work, the tantrums go away.

The key is consistency. Ignoring it one time, then disciplining the next will only send a mixed message and the kids wins. Every single time it happens, just act as if she's not even there.

[Hartz75]

Antoinette, that is what I was using for several years, she honestly would stand in the corner for an hour because she was told the time did not start till she was quiet. Then I was told that was too much time in the corner that it should be 1 minute for every year. but she would scream for longer then her year. It worked in the beginning but seems to have stopped.

I have done parenting classes and we do the positive reinforcements. But my god it got to the point that I was trying to find things to praise and they were stupid little things, even she laughed.

IADad, I have taped her and the 2 different ped's I went to refused to watch the tape, but in the same token told me I am over exagerating. How can you say someone is over exagerating when you don't watch to see what happens????

I have always tried a technique for several months before I give up. I just starting this ignoring so I will be consistant at it for a while.

I have thought she needs to see a therapist or something, her behavoirs are extreme and unusal, my family cannot handle her at all. She is great at school No issues, infact she is a straight A student. She has acted out at Daycare a few times. My younger daughter is totally opposite with her behaviour, she understands the corner and hates it, she gets one warning and stopps, she is only 2 1/2......

We currently see a naturopathic doctor who is exploring some things for us. She takes me for serious, we are looking into Autisum spectrum, aspergers and Bi-polar. She has a lot incommon with those "syndrums".

I will stick with the ignoring and not take vacations away, for now. thanks everyone. I will stick with it.

I love my daugher more then words can say and will do what ever it takes to help her. I appreciate the advice.

[Hartz75]

Oh and sorry about any spelling errors I have crappy spelling, and type faster then my brain works sometimes. LOL

[IADad]

Originally Posted by kdryan

You know, I love it when I am in Wal-Mart or something like that and a kid is just screaming his head off throwing some kind of tantrum, then you look at the parents and they are just ignoring it while people all around are looking like they should do something.

Ya know, that's a little bit different to me. If a tantrum is going to endangfer a child or be socially unacceptable, I'm going to fix that first, and then deal with "we can talk when you calm down" and ignore them while the atmosphere is under control. I think ignoring them at a store or such is really giving them attention because you're giving the a forum for it, all the unapproving looks of the fellow shoppers are giving them the attention they seek. (JMHO)

[Jeremy+3]

Kerstin sounds a lot like our son Jake, time outs do not work for him either, if you tried you would literally be putting him back on the chair/step until bed time. He behaves really well at school, because getting a little bored simply doesn't happen, plus the other kids will tell him to stop being stupid if he has a tantrum.

If Jake really misbehaves the day we are going somewhere he is warned we will leave him behind if he carries on, normally it doesn't come to that as he really hates to miss things.

There isn't one thing that works for him either, except maybe a straight jacket and a gag. With him though the best way to avoid his behaviour, is for him to have something to concentrate on, thankfully he loves colouring and keeps it on the paper and not the walls. Sometimes as well, normally if we are in the car he is allowed to play on a DS, bad I know, but if keeps him quiet...