20 year old son - NEED ADVICE PLEASE...

[M&B'sMom]

Hi, I am fairly new to this site, have read a lot of the "threads" and replies, I think you might be able to offer me some advice.
My son is 20 years old, soon to be 21. He graduated from HS with good grades (A- average), was section leader in Marching Band (we went on all the trips with him and his sister, incl. twice to Disney, etc), is an Eagle Scout (my hubby went on MANY trips with him, incl. FL and Canada), and basically never gave us any trouble at all in HS. He had one serious GF for 2 years and when she broke up with him, he did get depressed for awhile, but it resolved fairly quickly. He was accepted to his first choice college.

Then, he went off to college. He made a bunch of new friends and got himself a new GF, who we met and really liked a lot. After 3 semesters of terrible grades, we decided not to send him back. He got very depressed and angry at us. We then discovered that he was smoking pot, which is particularly bad for him, as addiction runs strong on both sides of the family (not with my husband or myself, but our sibilings and one parent). We insisted he go to counseling, which he did for a while. During this time, he was assaulted by someone while visiting my sister and nephew and 2 of his front teeth were knocked out. There were witnesses and he did nothing to provoke it, he is literally the last person who would ever hit anyone. The person was arrested and convicted on a felony assault charge. We continued to take him to counseling, which didn't seem to be helping at all. Eventually we stopped taking him.

Now all he does is sit (or lay) around the house, on his laptop or phone (which his GF got him on her plan b/c we took his away) or playing video games (which we eventually took away the game system). He barely looks for a job (only when we badger him to do it) but to be honest, the way he looks right now, no one would hire him anyway. His hair is long, although looks ok when he pulls it back into a ponytail, but he doesn't shave and looks scruffy all the time (can't force him to shave). As far as we know, he hasn't smoked pot in a long time (since early last spring), I think that is mostly b/c he has no money, plus we told him he will never get a job if he can't pass a drug test. He goes on and on about how pot should be legal. Craziness! He is still dating his GF, although I seriously wonder why she sticks around, as she carries a 4.0 in college, has 2 jobs and basically is on her way to a good life.

So, my hubby and I are at our wits end. We go between being so angry we want to pack his bags and literally lock him out of the house, to such serious concern that we think something is seriously wrong, as why would any one want this kind of life? We both work full-time, and are out of energy to deal with this. If we leave him a note, he will do household chores, but some days he doesn't come down until almost dinner time, and then is up half the night. He has state insurance, but it is getting ready to expire and he still hasn't filled out the paperwork to renew it. We are more than willing to take him back to counseling, but we don't want to waste our time again.

PLEASE HELP! Thank you!

 

[mom2many]

Depression comes to mind?

If that isn't the problem then mom I think you know the answer but are having a hard time with it. He has to get a job, go back to school and stop sitting around waiting for life to come to him. If he can;t find the motivation to do it on his own you guys are going to have to stop supporting him. Money isn't the only way to support him either. So long as he has a place to live and food in his stomach what reason does he have to "grow up"?

Set a deadline and be dead serious about it.

 

[Dadu2004]

Yep, I agree with M2M. The guy is 20 years old...time to force him to grow up.

"You have 6-months. On that date, you will be out of our house. I suggest you get a job and get your life together."

 

[TabascoNatalie]

Then, he went off to college. He made a bunch of new friends and got himself a new GF, who we met and really liked a lot. After 3 semesters of terrible grades, we decided not to send him back. He got very depressed and angry at us.

I don't really understand this part. It is you decided to cancel his education? Or did he actually fail?

 

[Xero]

I agree with the others. As a mom, I know that for me it would be SO hard to follow my own advice, but YES he needs his butt kicked into gear!! He needs that deadline. He is already 20 and it is only downhill from here. Don't worry about picking on him about pot or haircuts or shaving etc that is HIS problem and he is smart enough to know what will and wont get him a job. So let him worry about that, he is an adult and can figure those things out for himself, and it's just stupid stuff that you're stressing yourself over that you don't need to. Be loving and friendly with him, but also let him know that you will kick him out on X date (say six months from now to be fair). This will leave him no choice. Even if he crashes on somebody else's couch, he will learn from that how sucky it is to mooch off of other people besides your parents and he'll want to change it quickly trust me.

Good luck, that's a crappy situation!

TabascoNatalie - I believe they canceled his education, that was the way I read it. In America college is INSANELY expensive (like thousands and thousands of dollars) and I imagine they were paying for it or signing for loans etc. If the person getting the education isn't taking advantage of it, it is not worth the extremely large amount of money being wasted.

 

[M&B'sMom]

To clarify, his father and I decided he was not going back to college. We had been writing the check (b/c at our income, he would not qualify for ANYTHING), but he owes us half the cost, plus the cost of any failing grades, which there were a few.

I know you are all right, he needs a date and then for us to follow through, but the thought of that gives me headaches and heartaches and keeps me up at night. I was really hoping for a magic something to turn this around without that drastic a stand. There is a men's "shelter" nearby us that offers a "failure to launch" type program, but he has to be willing to do it and sign a contract to that effect. His father and I went to look at it and it is in such a BAD area of town, I was literally afraid to park my car and get out. I am afraid he would not be safe. I guess we could look into it again as an option.

Thanks everyone!

 

[spyparent]

hello all, I know I have jumped in a little late but I see several things that are very common in young men. I have a brother who is a year older then me and he went through something similar.

the biggest issue was that he was not being challenged and held accountable. he received a full ride scholarship on merit, and early on he breezed through with B's and C's in his junior year, his grades dropped and they threatened his finances, he knew he couldn't go to our parent's for money so he had to make a choice. Fortunately his competitive drive, got him going and he went off to grad school, eventually graduating with a masters from USC.

what helped him? he realized the only thing keeping him from succeeding was himself, and nobody is willing to pay for failure. he went into something that he really loves to do for work, and the most important thing is, if you love doing what you do, then it's rally not work at all.

- Deone

 

[Milliegene]

Seems like you have reached the end of your rope , I agree with an earlier post, give him 6 months

 

[IADad]

you know, just because you set a date, to cut him off doesn't mean that if he pulls himslef together, that 6 mont later or a year later or even 5 years later you couldn't help him out again. But I wouldn't offer that now, just know in the back of your minds, when gets it together it might be the greatest thing for your to be there and it might make it all worthwhile.

And personally I think he's still smoking. But I don't thin that's as big of an issue on it's own, just a contributor to problems.

 

[Buttaflly227]

O.K, first thing is first, how are you supposed to expect him to be an adult when you're not treating him like one? For example, it sounds like you were the one who pulled him out of college,(I assume this is because you're paying for it) and he was understandably angry about that, so why wouldn't you encourage him to do better next semester BEFORE you pulled him out? He certainly is capable of doing great seeing as how well he did in high school.
As for the smoking pot thing, C'mon. He's in college, it's not heroin. I'm not condoning it but it's nothing to send him to counseling for. Drinking has killed people, pot hasn't. I'd be more worried if he was drinking a lot. And remember he is 20 YEARS OLD! This is natural for college age kids!
Also, I'd be careful about saying things like you "...don't know why she sticks around..." because that makes it sound like you don't believe in or support your son when you say things like that. His girlfriend sees the good in him, and loves him, which is why she's with him. Maybe you haven't shown him enough of that when you've been concentrating on his long hair and bad grades.
You're focusing on all these external labels which aren't as important as who he is as a person. So what that he's an Eagle Scout? Is he passionate, motivated, feel loved, generous? THOSE are the qualities that matter.
I know you love him, you're his mother, and naturally you only want what's BEST for him. However, the way you're going about things may not feel very loving to him which is why he's acting so low.
My Husband's mother is the same way with him, even still. She happens to be a millionaire and wanted him to go to Harvard and all that. That's not who he is and wasn't what he wanted. However, we're both successful and she has forever burned bridges with us and our family because she didn't support him and didn't believe in what we wanted for our lives.
Remember too that every generation is different because we're constantly growing and changing. If we all did exactly what our parents wanted, nothing would change.

Hope this helps!

Be well,
Be at Peace,
- Jessica

 

[singledad]

OAs for the smoking pot thing, C'mon. He's in college, it's not heroin. I'm not condoning it but it's nothing to send him to counseling for. Drinking has killed people, pot hasn't. I'd be more worried if he was drinking a lot. And remember he is 20 YEARS OLD! This is natural for college age kids!

I have to disagree with this - Yes, pot on its own is not a big deal. But when someone with a family history of addiction, who is also suffering from depression smokes pot, it should set off all the alarms. I think they are perfectly right to send him to counseling.

Also, I'd be careful about saying things like you "...don't know why she sticks around..." because that makes it sound like you don't believe in or support your son when you say things like that. His girlfriend sees the good in him, and loves him, which is why she's with him. Maybe you haven't shown him enough of that when you've been concentrating on his long hair and bad grades.
You're focusing on all these external labels which aren't as important as who he is as a person. So what that he's an Eagle Scout? Is he passionate, motivated, feel loved, generous? THOSE are the qualities that matter.
I know you love him, you're his mother, and naturally you only want what's BEST for him. However, the way you're going about things may not feel very loving to him which is why he's acting so low.

With this, I agree 100%

 

[M&B'sMom]

ok, first, understand your points very well, believe me. I am not usually so hard on him, but this situation has been going on for a YEAR! We pulled him out of school b/c we were paying for it and he had BAD (some failing) grades for 3 semesters. He was given ample opportunity to do better and was encouraged to do so. He was angry, probably still is, but he has to get over that one!

If his ONLY issue was smoking pot, and he was doing all the other right things, getting good grades, had a JOB, etc. I might not be as upset about that one thing. I know it is "natural" to want to try drinking/pot smoking, etc. but I appreciate what singledad said, considering family history, the alarms were/are going off all over the place. Someone else had commented they think he might still be smoking, which I have considered, but I have NO IDEA where he could be getting the money.

My son does have LOTS of great qualities, in college he was majoring in education to be a teacher. He has an incredible amount of patience, which is one of the things that made him a good section leader in band and good in Boy Scouts, b/c he was always the one helping out the younger guys. Trouble right now is, I don't know how to get him to see himself that way again, which I think is why he isn't even trying. I cannot force him to see himself the way I/his father/his GF see him. Admittedly, it is very hard to see those things right now, when all he does is sit around, do nothing and expects us to accept him as he is! I did that for a while, but that time is LONG over. I actually do like his hair long, trouble is, most employers (right or wrong) don't. Same with pot smoking - where can you get a job right now that doesn't test for drug use? So, family history aside, you HAVE to be clean to get a job! Trouble is, he (mostly) isn't even applying, or he fills out the applications in a way that he doesn't get called back. His father spent hours with him making up a resume that sounded reasonable, he got an interview, but unfortunately, he got a "sorry, we hired someone else" letter. That was months ago.

I do not make comments (like the one about his GF sticking around) to him at all. I try to be as positive as possible, esp. b/c his father is much more annoyed/angry/furious/disappointed with him than I am. I was saying that here only. I know what she sees in him, believe me, but lets face it, she is 21 and working very hard to better her future for herself (her family life is HORRIBLE) so if I were in her shoes, I would think he (right now) represents everything she is trying to break away from.

Sorry about ranting on and one, guess I am just venting at this point. After I wrote that first post and read a few of the replies, I was about ready to pack him a bag and send him on his way, but then he went and worked a bit around the house, cleaned the bathroom and kitchen and made a really nice dinner and I caved in and didn't do it. I had asked him to do the chores, but the dinner was his idea and then he cleaned up. Now, he is at his GF's for a week or more. The GF's Mom won't let him move in there b/c of his "problems" whatever she thinks they are. I think that is ultimately what he wants.

Thanks everyone, for listening and more!

 

[bssage]

I think most take your OP at face value and are not trying to make a lot of assumptions.

Based from what you have said my assumptions are that you, your family, and your son are intelligent, articulate , reasonable people.

Someone asked about the "Eagle Scout" title. It infers someone has been recognized for being ethical resourceful and having the tools for being a successful adult. A significant achievement for a young person to have.

There have been a few posts over the years that I have felt this way about. Its because of what you have said. That at this point your options appear to be limited. I believe "tough love" is where not only most of the posts are headed but what you are thinking. I don't disagree.

I think you OP was clear. I think it showed genuine concern. I think your anxiety is the conflict between what you know needs to happen, and your passion to protect your boy.

<U>I would let him read your post</U>. I would let him read the responses. Then I would allow him some time to digest what he has read. He is not made to look foolish or otherwise a person who would not understand the wisdom of your concern.

This does not sound unlike the situation many people overcome as the come to age.

Becoming an adult can surely seem overwhelming at times. So is being a parent. Looking at what seems overwhelming people, left to their own devices, have been known to give up, throw in the towel. The only thing worse than this happening to your (our) kids is the thought that we somehow facilitated it.

I wish I had more to offer. Best of luck.

 

[TabascoNatalie]

I'm trying to see the situation from a different angle.
It seems, like you raised him to be a high-flyer. Good education, careers, secure middle-class lifestyle was pretty much planned and mapped out for him. He took it for granted and screwed up.
What now? whole meaning of life literally gone out of the window, major shock to the system.
Grow up, get a job -- seems pretty obvious and straightforward. But for him personally -- seems he doesn't know how to.
What about other alternatives? Military, volunteering for humanitarian organizations?

 

[M&B'sMom]

TabascoNatalie: That is why his father is so upset with him, he feels like we have him a great childhood to grow up in and now he is throwing it back in our faces b/c he fails to see the err of his ways right now. We have been hard working people all our lives, I stayed home until both my kids were in HS and raised them. I volunteered at their schools, with Scouts, Marching Band, etc., we went to all parent/teacher conferences, concerts, etc. My husband went with him on numerous scout trips (too many to count) and my son does not seem to appreciate any of it. Like, we were supposed to do that "so it doesn't count". The entitlement attitude drives us nuts! Neither my husbands or my parents did ANYTHING for us like that while growing up, a bit b/c for $$ reasons, but also b/c they just didn't. We wanted a different kind of life for our kids, and made that happen. My daughter works hard, is in grad school and while she lives at home, she is working on becoming a full adult. She has talked to him also, he just doesn't "get it".

Anyway, just as an update, he is now at his GF's for a week or two. Since she lives more than an hour away, I guess he won't be looking for jobs while there. Whatever that is worth right now.

 

[M&B'sMom]

Also: bssage: I appreciate all you said, really I do. It is very difficult to let the head rule the heart, if you know what I mean. That has always been hard for me, esp. concerning my kids. Too emotional. Working on that!

Thanks again everyone!

 

[TabascoNatalie]

TabascoNatalie: That is why his father is so upset with him, he feels like we have him a great childhood to grow up in and now he is throwing it back in our faces b/c he fails to see the err of his ways right now. We have been hard working people all our lives, I stayed home until both my kids were in HS and raised them. I volunteered at their schools, with Scouts, Marching Band, etc., we went to all parent/teacher conferences, concerts, etc. My husband went with him on numerous scout trips (too many to count) and my son does not seem to appreciate any of it. Like, we were supposed to do that "so it doesn't count". The entitlement attitude drives us nuts! Neither my husbands or my parents did ANYTHING for us like that while growing up, a bit b/c for $$ reasons, but also b/c they just didn't. We wanted a different kind of life for our kids, and made that happen.

I kinda see what you mean. You are angry, because all your effort backfired on you. It is NOT HIM, it is YOU who failed to achieve the desired result. You are upset, because you really worked hard and did everything right.

But for the boy -- he got everything what you wanted to give him, but he really did not have to work hard for anything, to fight for something. And he didn't learn to try hard. So he doesn't know how to. He can't really stand up for himself, and that must be an enormous sense of insecurity. It is really hard to find a job, if you don't believe in yourself.

Now if you really want to help him, try to put your upset ambitions aside. He needs encouragement that he actually CAN do something himself.

 

[lovemykids]

I've had a couple thoughts.....
If addiction runs in your family, I'd be really scared of pot....it will lead to other stuff. I've seen it in my home with my middle child. Pot in high school....eventually he was using opium and heroin. We have some addicts/alcoholics on my husband's side of the family.
It might be depression or it might be drug abuse. If he won't see a psychologist, then I'd tell him to expect a drug test in 2 weeks, 3 weeks....whatever you decide.
He doesn't have any money, but are you sure none of your money is missing? I'm only speaking from experience. Anything missing from your house or his room? Pawning things for money?
I'm a serious believer in Families Anonymous---a 12 step program for families experiencing substance abuse. Until they hit their "rock bottom", they are not going to come around. If that's finding his own place to live in 6 months or whatever becomes his wake up call. Do you have a community college in your area? That would be an inexpensive way for him to pay (take out loans) his way through school. You can reimburse if you wish when he passes the courses.
Our son was 20 when his problems came to a head. He was trying to pursue a 4 year degree to please the rich girlfriend (who I eventually believed wanted to marry a sugar-daddy who would support her in a life of leisure). Our son has ADD (these types tend to self medicate we're told) and has some difficulties in school. He was kicked out of Comm. College and layed around the house for about 1/2 a semester. Seldom showered or shaved, played video games, etc. We decided to have him check out a mechanical training program that will eventually get him a job when he's through and he is a different kid. Of course the girlfriend ditched him......I'm sure a grease-covered tool-toting boyfriend wasn't what she was looking for. He is happier now that he's ever been. Off drugs. Still living with us, but we are seeing a light at the end of the tunnel.
So, I'd set a calender for him. Decide on a departure date if he is not either going and doing well in school or working to support himself. If things seem to be going well in 4-5 months you can revisit your calender.
I would seriously look at the drug situation....pot is non-motivator....in spite of what people think.
Also another growing trend is SPice, K2, incense.....these are being smoked in place of pot and can't be detected on drug tests. They are very dangerous.

 

[M&B'sMom]

As an update, since I very much appreciate all your advice and words of wisdom:

My son has FINALLY gotten a job. It is working at a Dunkin Donuts and he is working the night shift in order to get more hours, as daytime workers only get 20 -25 p/week. He had to have surgery on his mouth, but only took 3 days off to recover, which is what the doc expected. He is looking into going to vo-tech school in the fall, probably for an 18 month full-time program that will give him some sort of certificate and job placement assistance when he completes it. He was initially annoyed when we told him he would have to take loans for it, but then calmed down when we told him we could consider helping him pay some of it if he passes with top grades (B+ or better). We let him keep a month of paychecks to get himself a head start on a new checking account, but as of this week, he will be starting to pay rent. We told him if he goes to school full time we would reduce or eliminate his rent, but he still has to work to pay car gas and insurance and personal items. He is ok with all of this. We are starting family counseling in a week or so, as he and his father are still struggling with communicating to one another.

So, we are working on a happy ending. Things are looking UP and I am grateful to all who offered support and advice.

 

[mom2many]

Thank-you for coming back and giving us an update. it's always nice to hear how things turned out. In your case it sounds like things are turning out good!