Questions on bullies. (a tick long)...

[HandInCup]

Seeing as how this is the most common age most kids either start to or fall victim to bullies, I was wondering on how strongly you parents feel on the issue. I've met many parents who have bullies as childern, and I've gotten many different views on it. One of the most common views was that it is neccsary to growing up to be bullied, and if your kid ends up being the bully, (s)he's just come out on top in the school yard. Another common one was that the parent acknowledges that their child is a bully, but feels that they will either grow out of it or that they can do absolutly nothing about it. I've also seen the "I don't care what you say, so-and-so's name would NEVER do something like that" and the "I will kick so-and-so's butt if they ever bully someone" kinds of parents too.

I suppose this needs a bit of explanation. I came from a very bad school that is known for bullies, and it seems the first two stated mindsets of parents are most common here. I've seen (and had) people throw items at others from their cars like entire half-gallons of milk and uneaten breakfast items, or even go as far as pour sticky liquids all over the windshield of other student's cars. There were also many fights, and people would jump around the corner and scream in your face to make you jump. And if you didn't jump, you were a freak because they couldn't scare you, so you became very, very strange.

But my younger brother is being targetted now by someone known for being a bully. I've talked with his parents and my own about the issue, because most days the bullying is so bad, he'll skip school and is in danger of failing. My parents said they will step in if he tells them anything again, and his parents said that there was nothing they could do because their child is not only out of control but also it is not happening in front of them so they have their doubts. Seeing how both sets of parents have a different idea of bullies, I was wondering how far a lot of people have come from the general idea that all forms of bullying were wrong. And it seems that it has differed a lot nowadays. I was just wondering some parents' opinions on the case, not looking for ways to tell other parents' their jobs or anything.

 

[fallon]

I feel very strongly that bullying is wrong. If my children were being bullied I would do everything I could to protect them. There are so many stories these days about it going to far and someone (either the one being bullies or bully) being killed. If my child were to bully another person the conscquences would be huge (not beating that's just dumb) and I promise I wouldn't need to actually see them bully someone

 

[mom2many]

This is a really hard topic, I see all points, if a parent isn't there when the bullying is happening it is very hard to correct it, but if a child and parent come to you and say there is a problem it should definatley be addressed. But at the same time I think children NEED to learn how to handle problems even bullying, bullys exsist in all walks of life, it's not just a childs issue, all of my kids have had to deal with some form of bullying, I stand back, I give advice and I only step in if I see it has gone to a new level, like how your brother is feeling. Once the child feels truly threatened then it is time to not only get the parents of the bully involved but the school and any other adult that needs to be involved, involved. Like I said a tough situation.

 

[Good Wolf]

My mom told me to challenge the bullies to a fight after school with both parties parents present.

After I went through a couple bullies away from school (without parents present of course) they not only stopped messing with me but tried to befriend me.

Although it won't work unless your brother can actually put up a fight.

 

[Momof12]

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Since I have a lot of children and the fact I have more daughter then son and all my girls were the Female Jocks they all stuck together. Meaning in numbers my girls were less targeted. As far bullies here in CA we have Zero Tolerance meaning if my kids were the target I would push the issue especially if the parent were not doing something. I do believe I holdthe school responsible and to keep this under control. Our children go to school to learn and should feel comfortable there. Its sad it happens </SIZE>[/FONT]

 

[BookWyrm]

Bullies are one of my big grrr issues. I loath them and the parents who allow their children to be a bully. Growing up I dealt with several, and even had one pull a knife on me when I was in 3rd grade. My father basically taught me that it was not ok to start a fight but if anyone brings one to you then make sure to finish it, because that is the only thing that will get them to leave you alone, since at heart bullies are generally cowards and if they know they cannot intimidate you, even if you cannot win an actual fight, they will end up leaving you alone. I took it a step farther because my own outrage over bullies led me to stand up and defend friends or even strangers who couldn't stand up for themselves.

My son has also dealt with bullies, and I've passed along the same philosophy. When he was in 1st grade, on the bus, several of the older kids (6th graders were the oldest on the bus) began taunting one of the other 1st graders, setting up some stupid chant and making the child cry, which they found hilarious... my son became outraged.. he began his own counter-chant.. "Leave him alone, leave him alone..." and got the other little kids going too.. until the 6th graders had no choice but to back down and even the bus driver was applauding (the bus driver shared the details with me)
He is very much the champion of anyone who gets picked on, whether friend to him or stranger. In 4th grade a little girl in his class was picked on on the playground and made to cry. When he found out after, (he didn't see it happen, but was told about it by another friend) he wrote the girl a note telling her that she was a good person and to never let what others say make her think otherwise, that it is what she thinks of herself that matters, and if she needed a friend he was there for her. He handed her the note while she was crying at her desk, and then went back out and told the boys who had been picking on her that they were to leave her alone... and she told the teacher who later told me and showed me the note because she wanted to commend my son.

More recently there have been 2 incidents. One involved a few little wanna-be-thugs in the neighborhood, just a few months ago. Two boys a few years older than him (they were 13 and 14, he was still 11 at the time) that he had briefly been friends with, came by and wanted to know if he wanted to hang out, they were smoking, and he told them no he didn't.. they asked why and he said because they were smoking and getting into things he wanted no part of, and then he came back in the house. About a week later, he was in the little field behind the houses playing and one of the boys asked if he wanted to play football (the 2 brothers were present along with 2 other boys, one 12 and another 14 year old) When he said no and turned away, the 14 year old pegged him in the back of the head with the football, when he turned to ask "What the??" they yelled that he was a snitch and jumped him. Apparently someone had told the mother of the brothers that they were smoking and they assumed it was my son. If wasn't but I wouldn't have objected to his doing so. Needless to say, he fought back, and threw off all 4 of them with ripped jeans and a sore jaw, came in the house a bit frantic to tell me what had just happened, and boy did I have a few things to say when I headed outside. All 4 boys were nearby and I let them have it verbally, wanting their names and where their parents were. They started off all cocky, and one of the brothers tried to be intimidating, threatening to jump my son in school, telling me I needed to watch my home and car. I laughed in his little punk face and reminded him that jumping my son wasn't a smart idea and then called the cops. The police couldn't do much of anything legally, but I also told my landlord, who filed his own complaint of trespassing, and evicted the family of which the 2 brothers were part, since this was not the first time they had started trouble and the mother had no interest in managing her children.
This brought out some good results also. One of the boys, came later to apologize to my son, and to me.. of his own volition. It woke him up and he and my son have since become friends, and he no longer tries to hang out with the thugs-in-training. Some of the older kids in the neighborhood actually took the other 3 boys to task, verbally.. 14 year olds jumping an 11 year old, and losing.. so the 3 boys lost a bit of their ego... and learned more people then they imagined, among their own peers, found their behaviour pathetic.

A totally different type of incident, since bullying does not indeed opnly involve children.. but is no less of a problem for some. My son attended a summer event with friends and there was an older woman who was handling the registration. Asking the kids their names and such.. but she was very rude and yelling at the kids.. nearly had one child in tears she was so harsh with them. My son's friend is chinese and not entirely fluent in his pronunciations with english so he really felt intimidated by this yelling woman. Now, my son has respect for his elders, but I've also taught him that he does not have to accept abuse from anyone, so I'm very proud of how he decided to handle this when it was his turn. She started barking and demanding and my son just stood there, politely and looked at her, but kept his mouth shut. After about the 4th time she lowered her voice and asked more politely. He answered her question politely and respectfully. She barked the next one and he again just looked directly at her, but said nothing. She
eventually got the hint.

Sorry for the length of all these examples, but I do have a point in wishing to show some incidents where I have seen solutions. It isn't always a fist fight. I'm always reminded of an old adage with this topic and I guess you could say it is my guiding principle where bullies are concerned... The only thing needed for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing. Parents need to take the first incident seriously. They need to empower their children to stand up not just for themselves but for those who cannot. Children need to know their family and siblings are there for them. That even if physical fighting is not involved, the whole..kids will be kids and they need to work it out on their own, mentality just allows the bully to flourish. They pick kids who they believe will not have support to pick on. We need to empower these kids that it isn't about physically beating the bully, but about beating them at their game of intimidation.

Ok, done rambling now.. again, sorry for the length, but as I said... I feel very passionately about this topic.

 

[AmyBelle]

I was bullied alot as a kid for two reasons
1. Im a redhead
2. My dad openly had a boyfriend
Ive been beaten up, had harassing phone calls, had my ponytail cut off, was teasted, taunted and made the butt of most ongoing jokes. This was by both children my age and adults. My dads only ever stepped in when an adult was picking on me (i.e, my grade 2 teacher who kept calling me 'Carrot' and would tell the rest of the kids that I needed special help because I had an orange brain that works slower than everyone elses) and im really grateful that schoolyard bullies were left up to me. It taught me how to be assertive and to brush off the idiotic comments.

I think a parent should onyl step in when its well out of hand. If a child dosent learn to hold their own with child bullies, then when theyre adults how are they going to deal with adult bullies?

 

[gremlin]

Bully children have lots of me in them LOL. I tell them they are only as good and as famous as the number of kids that they are able to bully. I am that nasty little voice in their back feeding them with negative and sabotaging thoughts. You wanna control me? No you can't. You can only tame me. Wanna know how? Come and ask this Jane Massengill who claim to know how you can tame me.

 

[etceterae]

I never had the violent kind of bullying. What I've had, instead, was mental bullying.

Basically, it was the silent treatment for three months straight, and for something I honestly hadn't done. It was the worst type of treatment to get - if a person calls you names, or pushes you, at least you can fight back. I couldn't even fight, because they'd outright ignore me. The only think I could do was pretend I didn't care (it really hurt me, though) and make new friends that weren't immature and power-loving as my old friends were.

I'm half-friends again with some of the people I got silent treatment from, but only one of them I am really good with (she's my best friend now, and feels that the silent treatment thing was extremely stupid of her).

Even so, I feel a little bullying here and there is really not that bad. Keyword: little. Not the outright silent treatment, and not backyard fights. Bullying is completely natural, and it's good practice for standing up for yourself.

I'm in JROTC, and two years ago when I was a lowly corporal, one of the lieutenants decided to freak me out. He came over to my face and started yelling at me, spittle flying everywhere, his eyes bulging and his face deeply scarlet. For a while I was terrified, but then I realized that he was being completely irrational and stupid, so I just stood there blankly waiting for him to finish. At the end of his spiel, he said, "GIVE ME TWENTY, CADET!" I said, "No, sir." He fairly paled, and began to sputter. At that moment I walked away from the formation and informed an instructor, who then gave the lieutenant the verbal whipping of his life. It was glorious. =]

 

[Aunt]

this is a thorny issue. I think parents of bullies often use excuses for their kids behavior out of embarrasment. Sometimes a kid is growing up in an aggressive home and they learn that it is acceptable. So to my mind it is important to get to the bottom of why a bully is behaving in such a manner and to then have them make it up to the victim. Teachers who bully or dismiss it should be dealt with particularly harshly

 

[Xero]

You know what you should do? Forget about the parents, that wont work. Don't bother telling anybody without a lot of power. If you REALLY want it to stop, go to the principal. MAKE him do something about it. Tell him you will get the authorities involved. If the principal does nothing, get the police. I'm not joking. It's called harassment. It's called assault. It's ILLEGAL. In my school district, they are so strict about bullying, it doesn't really happen too much. The minute someone reports it, the school officer has a talk with them. I've seen kids charged with assault. Fined. Sent to do community service. Anything. Your district might not be strict like mine, but you can enforce it if you really want to spare your little brother. If you're really passionate about it, you'll do it. It will work, the police have to do something about it, it's their job and bullying is illegal. Harassment as kids is just the same as harassment as an adult.

 

[jazili]

My mom told me to challenge the bullies to a fight after school with both parties parents present.

After I went through a couple bullies away from school (without parents present of course) they not only stopped messing with me but tried to befriend me.

Although it won't work unless your brother can actually put up a fight.

That would do the trick..., but certainly it's danger you know...

 

[Northvankev]

I am starting to work on a book idea for helping kids deal with specific issues that are the targets of bullies. For example, I envision one book dealing with a boy who likes to dance, another for a boy who likes to wear makeup, etc... (this is not to say that I'm going to ignore girls, only that I have two boys and most of their friends are boys, so I'm more familiar with boys at this point). I have a couple of questions for the forum to help in the design and format of these books:

1. Are there any books out now that you have used with any amount of success that have helped your child deal with bullying? If so, how did the book help?

2. If you were to hear about a series of books that deal directly with an activity your child enjoys but results in bullying, what would you look for (I'm keeping this question open so as to not limit responses)?

3. If there were a way to customize the book so as to make it even more specific to your child, would you be more or less likely to look into it?

And I think that's all for now. Thanks in advance for any feedback!

 

[Aunt]

One bok I have read that does not deal with bullies specifically but more the world of girls is QWueen Bees and Wanna Bees. It is excellent reading for anyone with a young adolescent daughter and looks at the cliques that they move in etc.

 

[The Kid Spammer]

Man, I hate when I get bullied and made fun of.

 

[Xero]

NorthVanKev - that sounds like a good idea. I would post your own thread though, if you really want responses.