Too Shy?...

[usingmybrains]

I have 2 boys, the youngest is 5 and the oldest is 8.

My oldest son doesn't talk much, if he's in the mood he will talk a little, but sometimes when I ask him a question he won't answer. For example today, I woke him up and told him to get up and get dressed. Once he got dressed, I told him to go brush his teeth, but he wouldn't go, I asked him if his teeth hurt or if the brush bothers him or something but he wouldn't say anything, he would just sit at the kitchen table.

I then tell him that we're running late and to hurry, but he just stood at the door, while I rushed to the car. When I get to the car, I look back and see him just standing there, so I go back and grab his hand and take him to the car. We finally arrive at school and he gets out of the car, but wouldn't walk up the stairs to the school's main entrance. I kept asking him if he needed something, if he had any problems in school, if he didn't want to go to school. He would just stand there and not say anything, so I told him I had to go and asked him if he's sure he doesn't want to tell me anything, so I just left, I saw that he started crying and I don't know if he actually walked into his school. There were some crossing guards and other school people there so I think they would have called me if he didn't go to school.

He has done this before. He would just shut down and not talk or answer to anybody. I don't know if he's just very shy or it's something else. This is not recent, he has done this for many years, but we didn't pay too much attention because we just thought he was just being shy and that he would grow out of it, but he's 8 and I don't see much improvement, he also still wets his bed most of the time.

 

[IADad]

I think there's something here...it seems that the prospect of actually being at school and having to face something he's afraid on is what brought on the tears, and I'm sorry, I could not have driven off. He would have been coming with me and we'd have gone some place and had some non-threatening discussions. It seems an awful lot like there's something at school he fears. Does this happen on the weekends? He's old enough to sit down and say, "You're not in trouble or anything, I can see you're worried about something, it's okay, you can tell me anything....and see where it gets you."

I know, I have the benefit of being your hindsight, but If I were you, I'd be going and getting him now.

I'm not sure if the bew wetting has anything to do with anything, unless it's possible it's become common knowledge at school.

You might also want to ping his teachers/principal, so they can be on the look-out and maybe give you some idea what's going on.

 

[usingmybrains]

Thanks IADad.

I think I may have phrased the question incorrectly.

The issue with my 8yr old son is that he does not speak too much, he will sometimes shut down. One day he wanted to put on a sweater that was wet because the night before it had rained and he was wearing that one. I said not that one because it was wet. So I ask him if he wants any other sweater and he wouldn't say a word, he would just stare at me. I kept showing him other sweaters and jackets but he wouldn't say anything, so it got late and I just got any sweater, helped him put it on, and once we got to the stairs he wouldn't walk down.

I asked him what's up, if he needed anything else, money? no response, forgot your homework? nothing. I knew it was the sweater but I wanted him to ask for it, but he wouldn't. So, I ended up saying something like "ohhh, you want to other sweater?" cause it was getting really late.

Things like that always happen, he also won't answer to other adults, sometimes he's open, but most of the time he's reserved. He had problems at school where he wouldn't answer to the teacher, so the teacher didn't know if he knew the answer or not.

Here's the weird part, my other son, the 5yr old, he doesn't talk at all in pre-k, he won't tell the teacher the alphabet if anybody else is looking. She has told me that he does know the alphabet and that he's the 1st one to finish his school work, he's very intelligent, but he won't talk. He wouldn't even participate in the pre-k graduation play. I once went to his class and did the whole play with the other kids so he could maybe feel more comfortable, the teacher told me he still doesn't participate but at least he goes in and watches the other. A few day before he didn't even want to go in the practice room. I find it incredible that a 5yr old would be shy or self-conscious, I think about all these things daily, torturing myself that maybe I messed them up somehow. I don't hit them, I do however spank them only when they do something really bad. I also think I've shouted too much at them, or maybe I spoil them too much?

I hope some of you guys can help me. I'd really appreciate some probing questions, to help me think and analyze my parenting skills.

 

[MomoJA]

First of all, it doesn't sound like this is due to your parenting skills. When I read your first post, my response was that you should have him analyzed to find out if there is something going on that you don't know about, or if he is on the spectrum of autism or something similar.

But when I read your second post when you started describing your younger son, it made me think it might just be their personalities and it's genetic. I still think I'd have your older child tested and I would seek counseling for him. Even if everything else is fine, it sounds like he is having some major anxiety and if nothing else, a counselor could help him learn to handle it.

Good luck.

 

[IADad]

^^ what MomoJA said, plus I wonder about the history of how these episodes end. For instance in the sweater thing, how did that resolve? It sounds like you ultimately had to take action to resolve it. Assuming you get him tested and there's nothing wrong there, can you try letting things run their course? e.g. if he doesn't like the sweater, then he's going to have to do something about it, either change it himself or tell you what his issue is/what he wants,but you don't step in and solve it. The kitchen table story, maybe pick a day and let him be late...I'm working on the theory that it's an attention thing for both of them, they get you to do things that way. And it could be a combination of the two. Maybe there is a functional issue with the older one, but the younger one is modeling their behavior on the outcomes of the interactions he see with the older one....I think getting that testing done, will be necessary to sort this out.

 

[usingmybrains]

IADad I think you're right. I think it's something like 'Learned Helplessness'. Me and my wife were talking about this today. We have come to realize that we do everything for them, we buy them anything they want, 'groundings' consist of them whining until we break, which happens most of the time. If they don't like what we cooked, they get to eat anything else. They have so many toys, you wouldn't believe it. They have two big totes full of toys. My wife, just last weekend bought them a lego set (Ninjago, about $60), they built it and forgot about it already. She also just bought them another DS game.

OMG, it's us.

Now, please tell me if this is a good idea: I'm thinking about throwing away their TV (which is old already, I'd say too old) and exchanging their DS for cash. Have them share the living room tv, and have them learn to sleep with no tv, maybe just with a night light. My older son, 8 yr old, told me he's afraid of the dark, and said thats why he wets his bed. He has been sleeping with a TV on for so long, too long (maybe 3yrs or more).

Second, no more choosing what to eat. If they don't like what's for lunch or dinner, too bad. I've realized they eat the same food, if it's different, then they want a sandwich, and we allow it.

The other question I have is how to deal with bilingualism. My wife speaks only spanish, she understands some english but does not speak it. I speak to my kids in english in order to help them learn english, but we've noticed they hardly speak to their mother because of this. What to do?

I'm also having problems locating a bilingual psychologist, I really want my wife to participate or should I just translate for her?

Thank you so much guys.

 

[JBKB3]

I am still not convinced that it is your fault. I have met many children who have been raised just like this and they turned out mostly okay, other than spoiled and lacking discipline. My first thought was a form of autism. At least with your oldest, the youngest as mentioned may be just imitating what he has seen.

If you decide to get him tested I would be interested in the results if you feel comfortable posting them here. It will help us help you.

As far as the bilingual thing, that is understandably difficult. I would imagine that the children would pickup both english and spanish and be able to communicate with both parents, especially if they have been around it their whole lives. For them to not communicate with their mother leads me to believe there is something else there.

JB

 

[abby]

It sounds a lot like autism to me, I woudl get him tested.

 

[ParentingPro]

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[Normal Parent]

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[Dieselman]

Every time he acts shy just give him a little "kick" in the balls.

 

[parentastic]

Dear UsingMyBrains,

There is a lot of information in your recent posts and I don't know where to begin writing the insights that come to me about your situation.
I hope I can provide at least a bit of light in there, but I think your situation might require the help of a professional. I am not really thinking of autism - although I cannot exclude it - but I think there are patterns in your family that a child counselor or a family life educator might be able to see and provide help. Through a forum, I can only do so much, but let's see what I could do.

First of all, it's not shyness. Although it is true that some children have a more shy temperament than some others, shy children usually aren't shy with their loved, closed ones. Shyness is usually about how you feel in groups or with strangers, not with your own parents.

Second, the fact that both your boys displays some of the same behavior points much more, for me, toward something related to your parenting and your own behavior in the family. In short, I would look at the solution in changing your family dynamics, not in genetics (although I cannot exclude that possibility).

Third, I would NOT switch from your current parenting mode to a "tough love" stance. "Tough love", an attitude in which parents suddenly become harsh on purpose "to teach a child to be responsible", are almost always the cause of deeper problems and will invariably erode or even sever the parent-child relationship. And the quality of the relationship is your biggest asset to solve this problem.

Forth, please, please please stop the spanking. Spanking a child has MANY serious negative effects, some of which might fit right in the pattern your are describing. They erode the parent-child relationship, they cause children to lie and hide their emotions (in an attempt to evade potential consequences) and they tend to mold children into either silent, obedient but artificial people who lost touch with their inner emotions, or rebellious children who tend to forcefully get into everything that could help them feel different and shake their parental authority. None of these reactions are healthy.

What is going on with your children?

What we know for sure, from your descriptions, is that your children DO have emotions, desires, fears, and so many emotions in various situations (we know that because every human being does), but they will not show or talk to you about these emotions.
Is it possible that they aren't sure what is the "correct" response - the one they "expect" you to require, to demand - so they shut down because they don't want to take the risk?

Also, your descriptions seem to indicate that you are taking a LOT of decisions for your children, if not ALL of the decisions. Each time you forcefully take a decision, you remove the occasion for your child to exercise his decision making abilities.

You need somehow to find ways to get you children to feel that IT IS OKAY to be themselves, to take decisions, to make mistakes, and so on.
You need to pay attention to each of these situation, even if you are late, even if you can't take the time: DO take the time. But when you do...
do not talk. I might be wrong, but I think you might speak too much. Give your children the space to speak. Don't be afraid of silences. Once you have told your child that they can pick a sweatshirt, don't end up taking that decision. Let them take it. Stay there - attentive, caring, smiling, engaging, full of empathy and love. Let the silences grow, but make it a good silence, a silence full of care and trust that your son will act. Not a silence full of blame and impatience. Encourage him with a smile. But don't talk too much - let him think, and slowly realize you are not leaving, you are not taking the decision, and IT IS OKAY whatever he decides. This should help, after a few repetition and a lot of time, to open the doors.

You might also want to investigate a technique called active listening.
You can search google all over the internet for examples of active listening. It's not an easy skill to develop, but it's VERY POWERFUL. It will help you truly listen to your sons and will open the doors to true communication. It is the same technique that is used by counselors to help their clients feel heard and listened.

I know it's easy to seek easy solutions, such as removing the TV and the toys or forcing them to eat the same food. But there aren't any easy solution. (not that removing the TV is a bad idea, actually - but only if you do so to replace it with real family interaction, board games, family games and discussions - not as a way to change his behavior magically).
The solution is within the relationship - the dynamic - between you and your sons, not with the toys or environment.

Good luck, let me know how it goes okay?

Nicolas
Family Life Educator

 

[mammaz80]

Let them come out of their shell naturally.

 

[samantha_blythe]

I second the last reply. It has to come naturally!

 

[kvtsharma]

Hi, i agree with others. I think its not just shyness . you need to invest more time with him to figure out , what exactly the problem is and if required please seek professional help. Please don't delay this.