Well, here we go......

[sbattisti]

So, my oldest is 15, a sophomore in HS. Good kid, good grades. Occasional dysfunction with mom (my ex-). Says all of the right things about smoking, drinking, etc.

So, here we go: was talking to the ex- on Halloween, and she mentioned that she was about to ground him because she believes he's been taking alcohol from her liquor cabinet. Not individual bottles, but she is convinced the levels have dropped significantly over the past few weeks, and it wasn't her or her husband. Based on this "evidence" he's going to get grounded.

I know what's going to happen here - he's going to swear he didn't do anything, and I'm going to get caught in the middle. Ex- and I try very hard to back each other up on punishments, but frankly part of why we're divorced is because she does tend to find wrong-doing where none has occurred.

So, the bottom line is, I will back her up on the punishment and talk to him to see if I can get any info out of him. I'm not 100% convinced it actually happened, but I'm not naive. I know that there are millions of "nice kids" out there who get good grades and say all the right things, and then go out and get drunk/smoke/do drugs.

The question is, how do I know, short of catching him red-handed? From the times he's been at my house, there haven't been any obvious signs of nefarious behavior. I clean his room occasionally (he's with me half of the time), and there's nothing hidden there that I can see. There is no alcohol in my house to steal. (Not a teetotaler, just don't keep the stuff around.)

There was one highly suspicious time when he came home from hanging out with his friends smelling like cologne, and he said that he and his friends got into a "cologne fight." I told him I wasn't born yesterday, and that if he came home smelling like that again, he could expect to get punished. Nothing like that has happened since.

So, I guess my question is, how do I get him to be honest with me? Assuming he IS drinking, how do I get him to stop? I know most kids will try this at some point. I just want him to be safe, and I don't want it to turn into a habit. He and I have a much better relationship than he and my ex- do, but that doesn't mean he's particularly open with me. Just that we get along well and don't fight much. I think he's more likely to open up to me than to her.

Just as a note, generally speaking, I'm not the "punishing" type. I mean, I'll punish if I have to, but I'm more interested in ways I can <I>get through to him</I> than ways I can beat the disobedience out of him!

He'll be back with me tomorrow night, and I'll need to speak with him then.

Thoughts?

~s

 

[Andy in NY]

what sort of "evidence" does your ex have? im not one to punish without rock solid evidence, or confronting the supposed evil do-er and watching their reaction to tell if they are lying. both of my step kids are the worlds worst liars and their reaction tells it all.

it sounds like your ex noticed booze missing and needs to hold someone accountable, and your son is it. even though hes not the only logical suspect. doesnt sound like much evidence though...

i would talk to the ex and see WHY she thinks it was him.

does he have any other history of drinking?

 

[Xero]

I'll have to say that he PROBABLY his sometimes drinking, and he probably did drink a little out of the ex's cabinet. I think I would do a couple of things. First of all, teenagers are going to be interested in and curious about that kind of thing almost no matter what, so he's not a bad kid. I personally blame your wife for keeping an open "liquor cabinet". My younger BIL used to get into his mom's alcohol all the time, but I personally think it was his mom's fault for leaving it out all over the place. I personally think if you don't want your kids getting into the booze then you need to lock them up or not keep them around. Its not that hard! I would probably tell her either way that it would be the most responsible thing for her to lock it up and keep the key somewhere he doesn't know about. I kinda think its like laying playboy magazines all over and expecting a teenage boy not to snatch one lol.

Its totally normal for him to be experimenting with this stuff with his friends. I would definitely not encourage it, but I would try to make him feel safe about talking to you about it. Its hard to say HOW since he's not my child, but its good for him to be able to be kinda open about it in case he gets in a situation where he needs help and whatnot.

 

[TabascoNatalie]

I agree with Xero. Storing booze at home with a teenager around is just too much of a temptation.

on the other hand... i'd allow tasting some of the things under adult supervision.

 

[sbattisti]

Yeah, I feel kind of similarly to you guys. Andy, that's about it as far as evidence goes. She noticed there is now less alcohol in her bottles, ergo it must have been Chris. This is typical of the way my ex- behaved with me as well. ("I can't find X, therefore Steve must have put it in the wrong place.") Unfortunately, there is no convincing her of alternatives. Her mind is made up, and that's it.

If it had happened at my house, I wouldn't be punishing without more evidence, but this is one way in which she and I are very different. Which makes it challenging to back each other up, because to me, it feels like she's always looking for something to get him in trouble for. But, I WANT to back her up, because I certainly don't want to encourage a co-parenting model that says "Any time you disagree with a punishment, go talk to the other parent and you might be able to get out of it." I really don't want to get into the "one parent vs the other" thing.

(For her part, I'm sure she feels that I'm way too lenient with Chris. Don't want to turn this into a "the ex-wife is to blame" thread...)

I agree, having the liquor around is a risk. I don't keep any at my house. It could be that she'll go that way too after having this "scare." Unfortunately, our relationship (mine and my ex's) isn't of the sort where she would take kindly to me making that suggestion.

Anyway, my <I>hope </I>is that he didn't do it at all, and this will just be a "this is so unfair" kind of punishment and we'll be done with it. My bigger concern is if he DID do it, what are the ramifications, and how can I nip it in the bud?

I want him to feel safe talking to me about it, but I also don't want to give him a complete free pass. He'll be driving in less than a year. I'd like him to NOT do anything stupid in the first place, but I'd also like for us to be in a place where, if he DOES something stupid, he'd be willing to call me and ask for a ride, rather than drive home drunk or something.

*sigh*

 

[TabascoNatalie]

i don't understand something... do you want him "guilty" to prove something to your ex?
well, you shouldn't. and "not caught -- not a thief".

 

[Xero]

Yeah I hear ya on the ex not taking kindly to constructive criticism haha. I guess if it were me, just because this is a pretty important situation and not just something silly, next time I talked to her I would probably say something like "This problem with our son possibly drinking is pretty concerning, and of course you obviously don't have to listen to my ideas, but I was thinking that maybe it would be in everybody's best interest if you could possibly get a lock for the liquor cabinet or put the alcohol in something that locks etc. It would of course be nice if we could just trust him not to touch it, but the temptation just doesn't seem healthy and maybe it will just be easier to keep it out of his reach?"

I just think that as a concerned mother somewhere in her heart past the "I just want to punish everybody" aspect of her she must be worried about it and it must matter to her to some extent that he's getting into drinking. So I don't think she'd be too angry about it if you were to gently mention it. However, hopefully you are correct when you say that she will probably want to lock it up on her own anyway after this scare. If she doesn't after some time though and this problem arises again, I would definitely think about saying something.

How do you convince a teenager to be open with you and yet not give them the impression that you're cool with them doing whatever they want? lol We'd be famous if we could figure that one out. I would still punish him when you find out he was drinking and whatnot, but here's one potential idea. Explain to him that you absolutely are not okay with him drinking, he's underage, its illegal, its dangerous, and he should not be doing it and he will have consequences. But I would maybe tell him that if he ever does something stupid and he finds himself in a dangerous situation, including the possibility of driving drunk, that if he calls you for help he will be in a lot less trouble. I would say this kind of thing would result in the minimum punishment. He shouldn't get off scott free, but he shouldn't be too scared to tell you either. That way he might at least be more likely to come to you in those tough situations.

 

[rick&beckykraem]

When our kids were young, we put child locks on the drawers and cabinets, because they were too young to make good decisions about sharp objects and cleaning chemicals (plus, we got tired of replacing things back into the cabinets). Can you ask the Ex to lock up her booze for a couple of years? She will probably be most responsive to this request if it comes from your son.

Regarding the conversation with your son, you may be over thinking your approach. Sometimes brutal honesty works best: "Your mother suspects you're drinking her alcohol, and while I have no reason to doubt her, I also don't have any proof either way. What would you think if you were me?"

In the end, if your son insists he didn't do anything, you have a great opportunity to talk about how integrity is built by staying out of situations where you're integrety can be questioned (that is, ask mom to lock up the booze).

Becky and Rick Kraemer

 

[superman]

he probably is usin up some of the booze, which im pretty sure as did when we wwere younger. honestly i think ur on the right track....not condeming him bout it and sayin its totally unacceptable. i know from seein friends and esp. my cousin is a good example of bein raised in a super strict household but as soon as she got out of the house she went nuts as far as partying goes. talk to him bout drinkin within limits, give him permission (if ur willing) for only certain times like @ a party he can only have 1 or2 drinks (whatever ur limit is).....hes probably gonna listen to that. make sure u tell him u trust his judgement i know 4 me trust always meant responsibility and hopefulllly hess gonna respct that

 

[Andy in NY]

he probably is usin up some of the booze, which im pretty sure as did when we wwere younger. honestly i think ur on the right track....not condeming him bout it and sayin its totally unacceptable. i know from seein friends and esp. my cousin is a good example of bein raised in a super strict household but as soon as she got out of the house she went nuts as far as partying goes. talk to him bout drinkin within limits, give him permission (if ur willing) for only certain times like @ a party he can only have 1 or2 drinks (whatever ur limit is).....hes probably gonna listen to that. make sure u tell him u trust his judgement i know 4 me trust always meant responsibility and hopefulllly hess gonna respct that

im torn on the whole let him drink part that you suggest. when i was 16-20 i drank, sometimes alot. it didnt matter what my mom said or did to stop me, i did it. sometimes not always responsibily, either. that being said, i dont think i could be part of letting my kids drink because even if i give them a "safe enviornment", they are still going to do it other times too, so im not stopping it.

 

[TabascoNatalie]

i do think it is ok to let a 16yo have a glass of beer or wine sometimes. yeah, i know in USA laws are different, but that's just my opinion. it is better that young people are taught in family how to consume alcohol in a responsible way, and not that they taste it first when trey're off to college and then run wild.

after all, i don't think storing booze at home, even under locks, is a good idea. kids are very good at finding hidden things at home. when i was about 8 and stayed in summer ar relatives, my uncle used to lock up the sweets from me and my cousins. well, for me it didn't take very long to find the key, my cousins managed to open the lock with scisors. it is funny now, because it was sweets in there, and not something more serious.
(if adults need booze, they can go and buy it anytime, so why store?)

 

[Hazel Carolina]

i let my 17 year old drink pretty much when ever he wants and my 14 year olds do but in moderation (glass of wine on special occasions etc) but like TabascoNatalie said the USA is different. I'm not sure where she is from but I'm from Australia and the law is that you can drink at 18 so i don't see a problem with my 17 year old drinking he is less than a year off being a legal adult. as for the 14 year olds i believe if you get to drink in moderation from a young age you have more respect for alcohol when you are older and don't so much have the need to get blotto every weekend.

i would probably still have some form of punishment if your son did take the alcohol though because no matter what my opinions on teenage drinking are the bottom line is that Chris was not allowed to take the alcohol which is stealing because he didn't pay for it nor did he ask for it.

i agree however with Xero and any other commenters, i think it comes down to your Ex's parental responsibility if you keep Alcohol in the house your teenager will drink it. and those my friends are the facts of life. my oldest three have all gone through Alcohol stealing phases (from their father, i don't drink much) and they all got in quite a lot of trouble but it was more for the stealing aspect than the drinking aspect, and they were all asked to pay him back for the amount they drank (not a lot of money but still teenagers don't like parting with it as a punishment) and it worried and they never stole alcohol again.. I'm sure my younger ones will eventually go through the same phase and will get the same punishment.

 

[superman]

im torn on the whole let him drink part that you suggest. when i was 16-20 i drank, sometimes alot. it didnt matter what my mom said or did to stop me, i did it. sometimes not always responsibily, either. that being said, i dont think i could be part of letting my kids drink because even if i give them a "safe enviornment", they are still going to do it other times too, so im not stopping it.

i get waht ur sayin but its such a touchy subject that cud go so many ways. i just think forbidding it wnt do shit, its only gonna make him more secretive about it...its not gonna stop it he just wont be open with his dad bout it or anything that happens regarding alcohol

 

[sbattisti]

Yeah, I've tried to find the fine line between forbidding and "Sure! Go ahead and drink!" I don't agree with permitting him to drink with his friends. I mean, if he wants to have a sip of wine with dinner, I have no problem with it in my house. That doesn't mean I'm going to give him permission to drink illegally with his buddies.

I've tried to explain about concerns for his safety and getting in trouble with the law and so on, and made sure he knows that I will be here if he ever DOES drink and gets himself into trouble. The LAST thing I want is him driving or riding home wasted because he's afraid I will kill him if I find out he was drinking.

Anyway, we'll see what happens. With any luck, I won't have to report back.

Steve

 

[david773]

I'd say catching him DRUNK would be the most important red flag. My parents didn't get the whole "alcohol is bad thing" when I was growing up and my brother and I frequently would grab beers from the fridge in front of my parents and drink them over dinner when we were like 16 or so. Their rules were "never get drunk."