Why are people so reluctant......

[singledad]

... to call social services when there is evidence that children are being abused?

I know I'm probably asking the wrong people, but I want to get the bottom of this, because it makes no sense to me. Every time I hear about children being abused and the adults around them doing nothing, or making a feeble attempt like speaking to the parents or reporting a "disturbance" to the police or something like that, something inside me dies. I just don't understand why it is so hard to just pick up the phone and report it to the proper authorities, or to take the matter further if said authorities don't pay the appropriate attention.

Is it ignorance? Do people think "Oh, they'll be ok?" Are people afraid that children get taking from their parents on a mere suspicion? Do people seriously believe that children are better off with abusive biological parents than in foster care? Do people not realize that there are many other measures that can be, and are taken before children are removed?

Or is that people simply can't be bother, its not their job, their business, their responsibility?

What is it? Why are so many abused children left to fend for themselves? Does anyone have any ideas?

And what can be done? I feel like lone voice, standing on my soap box, screaming my head off, and no one is paying any attention... Would an education campaign help? Should we campaign for legislation forcing people to report suspected abuse? Appeal to people's humanity? Any ideas?

 

[cybele]

Its something I dont understand either. Its along the same lines as when people see someone clearly in need of assistance, yet just walk past. I consider myslf very lucky to be in a position where I have the physical and mental ability to help someone, I better make the most of it.

 

[Antoinette]

Because I work with childrenmi
Am legally obliged to call the
Police/ DCP if I have any evidence that a child is being abused/neglected/ miss treated so I really can't answer your question

 

[BabyAngel]

Can't really answer your question... but I have some idea that it has something to do with the kind of society we are becoming.

SELFISH seems to be the newest thing with the western culture. All marketing that is being fed to us from everywhere all point in the same direction... take care of yourself, right now. Present gratitude vs taking care of the environment for future generations, that kind of thing...

At least that's what I'm seeing here in Canada ! Very sad, but it seems that people are getting more and more self centered more than anything. It's reflected in the government that we have (both provincial and federal).

 

[BabyAngel]

Kind of a "it's not my problem" type of thing !

Very sad indeed !

 

[mom2many]

What I see with people is fear and the possibility that it "might" just be them being sensitive about a situation/type of parenting.

What I actually see to much of is parents who think the answer to everything is call CPS. Sometimes it really does come down to different parenting styles, so where is the line drawn. It is not illegal to spank a child, it is not illegal to put them in their room and let them scream for hours. Get what I am saying, it is hard to say why a child might be screaming and crying, that smack might have been on the bottom and while harder then you or find acceptable it doesn't make it illegal.

 

[cybele]

I agree with you mom2many, heck, under a week ago I was threatened with child services for not celebrating Easter...

That said, its the ones where clearly something is up that get to me. I remember when I was little, there was a girl in my class who always came to school with bruises, not normal kid bruises, but black eye, swollen jaw, cuts to the lip, swollen up nose. Everyone knew she was being beaten. I went through my entire schooling with this girl, we went to the same primary and high school, we went right through from grade 1 to form 6 together (yes, form 6, I am that old, that is now grade 12) and she had bruises when we were little, because I remember asking my mother about them, and her telling me "We dont talk about Bernadette's face, dont look at her and dont say anything about it"

I remember her having the same bruises when we graduated high school. All through her childhood she encountered so many teachers, so many friends parent's, so many adults who just didnt say anything. That said, that was the mid 70's-mid 80's, convservative, white, middle to upper class Melbourne and that was the view back then, that you dont say anything. (Meanwhile, in between the punches you are giving your daughter, you were free to gossip about the Aboriginal children, and how the small homes they lived in equated to child abuse)

Its like we've moved past "Oh we pretend this dosent happen" and instead of moving into something positive, weve moved to "I dont care, unless its something that isnt really abuse and just personally offends me, then im going to kick up a stink"

 

[singledad]

Its like we've moved past "Oh we pretend this dosent happen" and instead of moving into something positive, weve moved to "I dont care, unless its something that isnt really abuse and just personally offends me, then im going to kick up a stink"

Exactly. You will always get people who think that not letting a kid have an easter-egg hunt is abuse, but surely most rational people are able to tell the difference between being spanked and a kid coming to school with bruises every day? Or between timeout, and the neighbour's kid crying and screaming non-stop, for hours at a time?

Either way, if we can't get a happy medium, isn't letting CPS waste their time on a few hysterical calls better than leaving the genuinely abused to fend for themselves?

I shudder to think how many people have come here, wringing their hands and crying that they know about children who are abused but they don't know what to do, and when they get told to call CPS, they don't want to... Those are the people I am talking about. Or those people who are always gossiping about that family where both parents are alcoholics, but they never wonder if the kids are ok...

 

[momtoallkids]

i can give somewhat of an answer.... if the parent of abused child finds out that it was YOU they retaliate. i have had it happen personally. i knew this "woman" that was neglecting her child. like severly. i called and reported her. multiple times! the end result was that her son was RIGHTFULLY taken. her worker told her what she needed to do which included not allowing a sex offender in her home and she moved him in along with many other things. her son is now in good hands, hes with his bio father. well she found out that i was the one who called from her worker (which by the way is illegal) so she in turn reported me. this caused them to open a case on me and my children (which they closed after 9 long months)
that is why alot of poeple dont bother. they dont want these people in their lives either.

 

[singledad]

i can give somewhat of an answer.... if the parent of abused child finds out that it was YOU they retaliate. i have had it happen personally. i knew this "woman" that was neglecting her child. like severly. i called and reported her. multiple times! the end result was that her son was RIGHTFULLY taken. her worker told her what she needed to do which included not allowing a sex offender in her home and she moved him in along with many other things. her son is now in good hands, hes with his bio father. well she found out that i was the one who called from her worker (which by the way is illegal) so she in turn reported me. this caused them to open a case on me and my children (which they closed after 9 long months)
that is why alot of poeple dont bother. they dont want these people in their lives either.

I'm sorry that was your experience, but I'm happy that at least your 9 months of frustration saved those kids from a lifetime of suffering.

I have to ask, though - if you report child abuse in the US, do you have to identify yourself? Here, I don't think you are required to give your name, so even the worst case worker can't out you...

 

[Jeremy+3]

Exactly. You will always get people who think that not letting a kid have an easter-egg hunt is abuse, but surely most rational people are able to tell the difference between being spanked and a kid coming to school with bruises every day? Or between timeout, and the neighbour's kid crying and screaming non-stop, for hours at a time?

Either way, if we can't get a happy medium, isn't letting CPS waste their time on a few hysterical calls better than leaving the genuinely abused to fend for themselves?

I shudder to think how many people have come here, wringing their hands and crying that they know about children who are abused but they don't know what to do, and when they get told to call CPS, they don't want to... Those are the people I am talking about. Or those people who are always gossiping about that family where both parents are alcoholics, but they never wonder if the kids are ok...

Do you not see the flaw in idiots calling CPS? While people are calling the CPS for stupid issues those people calling for genuine issues are left waiting as are the child/ren concerned, it is no different to prank calling the police or fire brigade. People making false accusations should face prosecution just as those do who make false accusations to the police.

 

[singledad]

Do you not see the flaw in idiots calling CPS? While people are calling the CPS for stupid issues those people calling for genuine issues are left waiting as are the child/ren concerned, it is no different to prank calling the police or fire brigade. People making false accusations should face prosecution just as those do who make false accusations to the police.

Of course I see the flaw, and I can only imagine how frustrating it must be for the case workers and the negative effects it has on real cases.

However, I'm not sure about prosecuting people who call when there isn't something wrong. Its easy to see if someone was deliberately wasting the time of the fire-brigade - there isn't many things that can be mistaken for a burning building. On the other hand, there are many things that can be mistaken for child abuse. So where do you draw the line? How do you tell a prank from an honest mistake?

I believe that the last thing we should do is to nurture the idea of "don't call CPS unless you're 100% sure". Ordinary people aren't qualified to tell for sure, especially considering that there is often very little physical proof, even in some of the worst cases of abuse. People should be encouraged to call on a hunch... that feeling in your gut that says a child isn't being treated right. I believe the day that people don't call for fear of being prosecuted, should his/her hunch be proven wrong, would be a terrible day for abused children world wide.

But then, people aren't calling anyway, so perhaps it won't change all that much

 

[Jeremy+3]

It is extremely easy to tell who is being malicious, even the simplest of simpletons could work it out in a few minutes.

In the UK over 90% of reports to social services are malicious, with the majority being women who are attempting to stop their ex partner accessing their children so that they can receive more child maintenance from their ex partner.

The second largest group is jilted women reporting ex partners of being abusive/neglectful towards their own children as a form of revenge.

In the UK the biggest cause of children suffering extreme harm within the home is because social services are too busy dealing with people and their malicious calls, without those calls at risk children could be removed where necessary and parents could be helped where necessary at least 9 months earlier, not only does that reduce abuse/neglect and improve the child's future but it would reduce the number of children being killed by their parents by over 80%.

Abusive/neglectful parents know this as well, so many will up the abuse/neglect after the first visit from social services as they know it will be months before they see them again.

 

[BabyAngel]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nn5jlrxcpkI

Makes me laugh !

 

[momtoallkids]

I'm sorry that was your experience, but I'm happy that at least your 9 months of frustration saved those kids from a lifetime of suffering.

I have to ask, though - if you report child abuse in the US, do you have to identify yourself? Here, I don't think you are required to give your name, so even the worst case worker can't out you...

no you dont but depending on the details you give, its pretty easy to narrow it down. besides that i had met her worker.
this is the second child of hers that the state took. her sister has 4 that the state took. its a shame. some people shouldnt be allowed to breed.

 

[cybele]

But then its a round about argument because if people dont report at all, then kids still suffer and still go without the intervention of authorities.

Possibly the answer might be some educational compaigns about false reporting. Or defining what is reportable and what isnt. That said, we had a campaign here a few years back, and the message they were trying to get across was "If youre not sure, call anyway" so from there, if thats the message they want to get across, then we need to look to the governments to put more funding into child protection and open up more places for jobs and to really encourage the career.

I have been reported. It sucked to think that someone out there was that offended or concearned, I dont know what the reason was, by the way I raise my children that they went and reported me. I dont know who did it, it was quite a while ago, before Sasha was born and from memory Lux wasnt even walking yet. The allegations made were not enough food, that the kids were forced to sleep on the floor of our two bedroom house because we didnt have enough space to keep them and there were farm animals roaming the property and defecating everywhere.

The case closed quite quickly, a case worker and a police officer came in, they saw that the house was, in fact, a 4 bedroom plus study sized house (which, okay, ill buy that its deceiving to the eye, the house is quite long and narrow, and its on a slope so it has a few half levels, so from the street it looks much smaller than it actually is), and each child had their own bedroom with a bed in it. The only animals we had, at the time, were two cats, who are all house trained and go outside and some goldfish. They saw that the house was clean, and they looked in our cupboards and saw them full of food. They interviewed neighbours, friends and family who were all baffled by the allegations.

They kept the case open for the mandatory 6 months, did a secondary inspection, where everything was exactly the same, then closed it and expunged the record due to false reporting.

Yeah it sucked, and I was angry, and yes, their time could have been much better used on children who actually are in harms way, however, what happened happened and in hindsight, im not angry about it, I dont know what the motivation behind the reporting was, I cant think of anyone who wants "revenge" on us, or has openly disputed us who knows us, but im glad that there is a department out there who can take care of kids, the catch is that they do rely very heavily on the public and anonymous reporting. Without it, they wouldnt be able to do their jobs the way they do.

 

[singledad]

In the UK over 90% of reports to social services are malicious

Ok, not knowing the stats, I had no idea it was that bad. I wonder how other countries compare?

Possibly the answer might be some educational compaigns about false reporting. Or defining what is reportable and what isnt. That said, we had a campaign here a few years back, and the message they were trying to get across was "If youre not sure, call anyway" so from there, if thats the message they want to get across, then we need to look to the governments to put more funding into child protection and open up more places for jobs and to really encourage the career.

This sounds like the type of thing I had in mind. Too many people have no idea what is or isn't abuse/neglect.

I'm considering writing a letter to our local talk-radio about this issue. They have a policy of encouraging their listeners to raise important topics, and I don't put it beyond them to actually get someone from social services on radio for an hour or so... might reach several hundred thousand people in three cities... it won't solve the problem, but its a start?

And perhaps if we can encourage other people in other cities across the world to use whatever channels available to them to raise their voices and bring this to the attention of as many people as possible, we can at least make a small difference?

 

[Jeremy+3]

Ok, not knowing the stats, I had no idea it was that bad. I wonder how other countries compare?

It is fairly common in the west/countries with high divorce rates and a system where one gender is generally favoured in custody agreements and where a parent is rewarded financially for reducing the second parents contact time. Obviously in countries where men are favoured they are more likely to maliciously report, and in countries where women are favoured they are more likely to maliciously report. The number of people making malicious reports is more common in poorer regions/countries as well as the resident parent has more to gain from fraudulent behaviour.

In the UK you do not have to give your true name, but thats pointless as obviously social workers would need to see you directly and take a statement from you.