Step parent/step child discipline......

[txstepmom]

I had great fun reading the spanking debate threads! So I wanted to ask my own questions regarding spanking and other forms of discipline from a step parent perspective.

How many of you have a biological child who spends time with a step parent? And those of you with that situation, do you agree with that step parent disciplining your child when necessary?

If you, yourself, are an advocate of spanking, does that disciplinary tactic extend to the step parent (assuming you trust that person to practice good judgement)? Or do you expect the biological parent to handle all discipline and leave the step parent out of it?

Now, let me say that I do not think that resorting to a spanking in every situation or as a 1st level of punishment is right. I DO believe that not all children benefit (for lack of a better term) from spankings just as not all children benefit from taking things away or time outs.

I grew up with a mom and dad who spanked our bottoms when we misbehaved. Mom used a big wooden spoon. Do I feel I was abused? No way. Was it effective? Yes it was. We also got soap in our mouths when we wouldn't stop sassing. Let me tell ya - that leaves an impression and it only happened a couple times b/c I learned to bite my tongue! Did it damage me in any way? No.

Again, just b/c I was raised with some amount of corporal punishment... doesn't mean I think it is effective in every situation with every child. My SD10's (10yo step daughter - is that the right shorthand? I'm new to this) mother spanks her but does not want me or my husband to spank. In fact she'd rather us not punish in any way. She about has a coronary over the subject. Well, sorry, but when the child misbehaves, she's going to be punished. And I'm not of the opinion that the "Wait until your father gets home" strategy is effective. I spend a lot of time with my step daughter and DH is not always home - discipline is practiced as needed.

Now, when she was younger taking things away simply did not work! She was not attached to anything deeply enough to care about not having it. No TV? Didn't care. No [insert other fun activity here]? Didn't care. But the thought of a spanking scared her into obedience! Most of the time a threat would be enough. The times she thought the threats were idle and kept misbehaving, she got spanked and we always reinforced the punishment by making sure she understood the action/consequence. Spankings have been very few and far between but for HER, they WORK where other punishments did not!

A little older now, she has a few things that are important enough to her that grounding works. Her favorite sweater, Nintendo DS, mp3 player, no sleepover with grandma, etc... she thinks twice when faced with losing these privileges. However, we've had a problem now and then with lying (and I've never seen anybody stick to a story like this girl!) and arguing/disobeying. Her BM tells her all the time that we are not allowed to spank her so she test the waters sometimes. And she still sometimes gets spanked.

I read in the other spanking threads that 10-12 years old is too old for spanking. I don't think so - not when they throw themselves on the floor and ACT 3 years old! Some instances call for whatever works to punctuate the fact that they can not lie/disobey/back talk/etc... and sometimes grounding just doesn't get the point across.

I'm also of the opinion that a little bit of embarrassment goes a long way. We've had to discipline in front of friends/family a few times when she thought she'd get away with something simply b/c there were other people around. Being ashamed of your bad behavior is a characteristic that will serve well into adulthood, I think. I work at a high school and daily see the results of absentee parenting. As teenagers, they have gotten away with too much without consequence throughout their lives and it shows.

And my last question - for you step parents out there who are faced with situations requiring discipline, what are the strategies you've found MOST effective???

 

[bssage]

Let me say I don't think anyone "advocates" spanking. The debate was about if it could be used effectively and without harm.

Kinda a trick question. Even though I am not a step. The question could be posed for my brother or grandmother in law ect... any one who provides care.

I think it has to do a lot with the amount of trust you have in the person you are referring to. When the kids are with my brother or the inlaws. I tell them that they follow the rules of the house and tell grandpa or whoever in front of the kids if they need to spank they can. But I do this secure in the knowledge that its not likely they will. And if they did they would have a really good reason. I know them well enough and trust them enough. That I feel comfortable with that.

You however are in a different situation with the Bio mom. And as a divorce is likely in my future I can say I would have a problem with whoever my soon-to-be-Ex was with spanking the kids.

Since you and the Ex have a clearly adversarial relationship. I can see it would be a problem. I can also see how that could escalate to the point of becoming a major point of contention.

My opinion is I would come up with some other way. I am not saying you cant. Just that I would avoid it like the plague. There are several other very effective strategies. I think I would read up on them and try to become an expert at implementing them.

I know that's probably not what you want to hear. And its not really what I want to tell you. But the fact is Bio mom does not and probably will not have that kind of trust in you. Right or wrong, I think that's a fact you just cant get around.

A good jumping off point for researching strategies for parenting or discipline is the WiKi. I use it a lot and they generally link to anything you may want to check out.

 

[momtoallkids]

the trick is to teach them from birth that you demand good behavior and respect from them and you can do it without having to lay a hand on them if you start early enough. my kids get the "timeout" punishment and it works well most of the time. they hate having to sit there and stare at the door for any lenghth of time. another trick we use is physical (not violent) punishment. for example when my 10yo talks back its 20 pushups. now see that doesnt work for all my kids. i tell my 7yo daughter to do that and she will laugh at me and do 60 just to spite me. timeouts are her horror. my 16mo has even gotten the point of a timeout and knows he doesnt like them so when he does something wrong and has to get taken out of play time and put in his bed for a min or 2 he doesnt like it and when he is let free he doesnt do it again. you got to start it young. you will never have a nned to raise a hand to them.

another trick is brutal honesty in gorey detail. personal experiance helps. for example, my daughter used to never stop and look before running. well i explained to her what could have happened then showed her pictures of what it looks like after being hit by a car and ill tell you what, she hasnt run out in the road since. another example is my 10yo was trying to read under his blankets with a candle(this was before we took full custody from his bio mom) i showed him what a house that burnt down looked like along with what a burn victim looks like and explained just how lucky he was. he hasnt done it since. sometimes you have to scare some sence into them.

 

[TabascoNatalie]

Now, when she was younger taking things away simply did not work! She was not attached to anything deeply enough to care about not having it. No TV? Didn't care. No [insert other fun activity here]? Didn't care. But the thought of a spanking scared her into obedience!

so the point of what you call discipline is to hurt and scare the child? :frown:

 

[txstepmom]

so the point of what you call discipline is to hurt and scare the child? :frown:

Effective correction of disobedience, rebellion, belligerence, etc. is what I call discipline. When grounding, revoking privileges, time outs don't work *which they do not for all kids at all stages of life* how do you effectively discipline?? You make it sound as if I intend to terrify and beat a child. If that were my goal I'd not be in a parenting forum. That said, a properly administered spanking to a child's bottom - and yes, that's briefly painful - makes a point where other tactics don't.

I don't believe there is any set list of rules for how to discipline. If you'll read my original post more carefully, you'll see that. It's not about whether or not you think spanking is acceptable. Nonetheless, as I also previously said, there are times when putting them in a corner does not correct their behavior. Trust me. I've tried it all. Would yo say that sitting an 18-month old child in the corner or taking away a toy effectively teaches them not to hit their sibling or whatever the behavior might be? I've not seen that work. But a quick flick to the back of the hand gets their attention and does not inflict harm. Scare them a little about what the next step is if they don't obey?? That's a far cry from "hurting and scaring them".

I'd rather spank a child for continually running into the street and scare them than have them get hit by a car because a time out did not work well enough for them to learn that obeying can sometimes mean the difference between life and death. I was in that exact situation as a child. I started to run across a parking lot and my mom yelled stop - had I not obeyed, I'd be dead. And I was a sassy, difficult child and got plenty of spankings when I didn't obey. Grounding didn't work for me, not even into high school. Taking the car away? I didn't care. I found other things to do.

Spare the rod; spoil the child. That doesn't mean beat them! It means apply what discipline works.

On the other hand, I'm also a firm believer of positive reinforcement. I'm sure this will get blown way out of proportion but try not to take it the wrong way - "training" a child follows a lot of the same principles as training an animal. They respond very well to positive reinforcement. They also respond to physical consequences. If you dog keeps nipping at you, do you put them in time out? Do you just wait til they stop then give them a treat? No, you usually swat them on the nose. Eventually they get the point. Another example - at some time in our lives we've all probably burned ourselves on a hot stove or pan, right? We knew it was hot, knew it was "wrong" to touch it but did it anyway. The pain from a burn teaches us to think twice the next time, right?? Kids fall off their bikes. It hurts. We tell them to get back on! Are we encouraging them to keep hurting themselves? No... we encourage them to learn to ride so they don't get hurt. IMO, that applies to obedience as well. We encourage them to get it right so they grow up safely and with good character. If there are a few bumps along the way... well, that's life.

Momtoallkids - I love your constructive ideas!! Thank you. Bssage, yes the relationship with BM is adversarial, much to my dismay. Were it the other way around, you better believe my child's step parent would be my best friend! LOL If I give the impression that spanking is a regular occurance, it isn't. In 7 years, I've probably handed out a spanking 3 times and only because DH was not going to be home anytime soon and the situation called for it. I always try other ways 1st and let DH handle spanking if needed... just curious about other situations that may be similar to mine and how the stepmom handles them.

 

[bssage]

"training" a child follows a lot of the same principles as training an animal.

this could be taken wrong also. But I am a big fan of "The Dog Whisperer" and use his calm assertive energy approach with the kids quite a bit

 

[mom2many]

I am technically a step-mom to 2 of my children. In the beginning when I was trying to keep her involved (the bio-mom) I did abide her rules of discipline. However,s he stepped out of the picture a few months in and I have raised them ever since (they were very little) so I try to not say that I am a step parent even though legally I am.

Like I said in the other thread. I have no problem with a swat to the butt. My stance to you was that the bio-mom said that she did not want you spanking her child...regardless of whether or not she does. As long as she is the custodial parent, I feel that her wants should be 'respected'.

Now for her to say that you can not discipline the child. I would call bull on that one. I will discipline anyone's child who is in my house and does something wrong. There is just a line that I will not cross and that is spanking someone else's child, even if they say I can. I feel that a spanking should only be handled by the parent. That's my belief, doesn't mean that others are wrong.

 

[txstepmom]

I respect your opinion. My personal issue with K's BM becomes more than just "she doesn't want me to spank"... it becomes a card to play by K. Her BM tells her all the time that I have no authority over her, that I'm not allowed to make decisions or discipline beyond suspending privileges. BM is one of the most manipulative people I've had the displeasure of knowing and drags her child into her dislike for both DH and I. So K thinks she can use the "my mommy said you can't spank me" excuse when she's in trouble and doesn't like the upcoming consequence, regardless of what it is. Does that make sense? It's important to us that she doesn't question authority from parents, grandparents, step parents, etc. Having that "ace" up her sleeve makes her more rebellious. So it is complicated as all blended family situations are, I think!

 

[mom2many]

I respect your opinion. My personal issue with K's BM becomes more than just "she doesn't want me to spank"... it becomes a card to play by K. Her BM tells her all the time that I have no authority over her, that I'm not allowed to make decisions or discipline beyond suspending privileges. BM is one of the most manipulative people I've had the displeasure of knowing and drags her child into her dislike for both DH and I. So K thinks she can use the "my mommy said you can't spank me" excuse when she's in trouble and doesn't like the upcoming consequence, regardless of what it is. Does that make sense? It's important to us that she doesn't question authority from parents, grandparents, step parents, etc. Having that "ace" up her sleeve makes her more rebellious. So it is complicated as all blended family situations are, I think!

All children have a card to play and all children will play their parents against each other. The older they get the more they do it, it is about testing boundaries. The next time she says that to you I would say..."You are right, and I won't because I will respect this one request from your mom. However, that does not mean that you can do as you want, when you want. Certain actions will always have a consequence." Then dish out a consequence.

One thing that might work in your situation is sitting down with her and setting up some house rules. Allow her to help decide what the consequence will be each time she breaks a rule. You can make it a straight across the board, meaning that every time she breaks a rule it will be X that happens or you can be creative for each new rule.

I have done this with my older set (the younger are still a little young but they'll get one also here soon). It's adjusted over the years, but it's been great and cut's down on a lot of the "I didn't know that" that kids also like to do.

Just a thought, sometimes giving them a say in what happens helps them feel like there is some power...even in a punishment.

 

[parentastic]

Effective correction of disobedience, rebellion, belligerence, etc. is what I call discipline.

Yet the root of the word comes from "disciple" which means a learner-mentor relationship. Since them, we use the word in a way that distort its original intent.

When grounding, revoking privileges, time outs don't work *which they do not for all kids at all stages of life* how do you effectively discipline??

You could also revise your definition of discipline, take a step back, and wonder <I>why</I> it's not working - rather than resorting to escalation of punishment to the upper level, using <I>more</I> of the <I><U>same</U> </I>tactic.

And what if the spanking does not work - what do you do then?

You make it sound as if I intend to terrify and beat a child. If that were my goal I'd not be in a parenting forum.

I don't think there is <I>any</I> genuine parent spanker who believe or intend to terrify and/or beat their children. The question isn't what the spanker thinks they do. It's how the child sees and feels it. It is sort-of an oxymoron: if it wasn't scary and painful, it wouldn't <I>work</I> right?

That said, a properly administered spanking to a child's bottom - and yes, that's briefly painful - makes a point where other tactics don't.

But does it makes the point you think it makes, in the child's brain?
And does it makes a lot of other unwanted points?

There are times when putting them in a corner does not correct their behavior.

Indeed. There are times when punishment doesn't work.
Why is it that thinking of <I>more</I> ways to increase <I>more</I> punishments is seen as a solution? What is the <U><I>root cause</I></U> of the child's resistance to your teaching?

Trust me. I've tried it all.

Within your definition of "discipline" as stated above, I believe you have.

Would yo say that sitting an 18-month old child in the corner or taking away a toy effectively teaches them not to hit their sibling or whatever the behavior might be?

No more than a spanking. None of the above acts will teach a 18 month old (a year and a half!) not to hit their sibling, because:
a) at 18 month old, you don't even understand that other people hurt when you hit them
b) at 18 months old, the human brain in its early stage of development is not able to understand that other human being feels, thinks and perceive differently than they do (this is called the 'child egocentrism' effect in developmental psychology)
c) Their smaller motor skills are not developed enough to fully be controlled without a lot of demonstration (modeling) and training (repetitions)

The best effective way to teach a toddler not to hit is to catch him/her in the act, then take their hand in your hand and re-do the act with them, <I>gently</I> and <I>softly</I>, while you repeat "soooooft". Show what to do and do it with them; telling them what not to do at that age is useless.
So is the punishment or the spanking: they can't even make the connection between what they did or why they did it and the negative feelings of fear, anxiety and pain that you inflict on them.

I've not seen that work. But a quick flick to the back of the hand gets their attention and does not inflict harm. Scare them a little about what the next step is if they don't obey?? That's a far cry from "hurting and scaring them".

An 18 month old toddler receiving a flick to the back of the hand when they hit their brother will stop because all of their focus and attention is now on the pain and the sheer <I>surprise</I> of the betrayal of being hurt by the person they are programmed to follow and seek support from.
I can promise you that at that age, at that point they don't even remember what they "did" and have no way to make the link.
What they *DO* get however is that obviously hitting is OKAY, because mom just did it to him/her. Modeling is in full power at that age.

I'd rather spank a child for continually running into the street and scare them...

Wait. If they are <I>continually running into the street</I>, then how can you claim your spanking works? If it did, they wouldn't do it again, now, would they? See above about why spanking doesn't teach what you claim it does.

Spare the rod; spoil the child.

Religion as the basis for spanking, then?

I'm sure this will get blown way out of proportion but try not to take it the wrong way - "training" a child follows a lot of the same principles as training an animal.

In your own definition of discipline, I can see why you would think that.
Yet children aren't animals: unlike animals, they have language. They can learn <I>why</I> something should or should not be done.
In neurobiological term, children can learn from their higher brain function - the frontal cortex - even if it is a long training process that takes 25 years to fully complete. Animals can only use their reflex/reptilian flight/flight/freeze response, and so you are limited to training them (through reward and punishment, what Dr Skinner calls 'operand conditioning'), rather than <U>teaching</U>them.

Another example - at some time in our lives we've all probably burned ourselves on a hot stove or pan, right? We knew it was hot, knew it was "wrong" to touch it but did it anyway. The pain from a burn teaches us to think twice the next time, right??

Are you suggesting children should see their parent and their parent's decision with the fear you may still have in you after you have burned yourself on the stove? I understand why TabascoNatalie was asking you about scaring and hurting children?

Kids fall off their bikes. It hurts. We tell them to get back on! Are we encouraging them to keep hurting themselves?

Bikes aren't raising a child. Nor are stoves. Parents are.
Children do not have deep psychological dependency to bikes and stoves. Their relationship with the stove or their bike do not define their entire life. They do not require unconditional love from their bikes or stove.
That's why natural consequences are effective - because they teach, yes, but without the detrimental aspect of eroding the crucial attachment relationship that develops between parent and child.

IMO, that applies to obedience as well. We encourage them to get it right so they grow up safely and with good character.

I don't know, in my world, it is understanding and critical thinking, not blind obedience, that I would want to develop as an objective for children.

 

[txstepmom]

Wow... really??? Anybody can take someone's words and twist them around to fit their objective but that... was... um, an impressive bit of twisting there!

Let's talk about the definition of discipline. From Merriam-Webster:
As a noun-
1. Punishment
2. (Obsolete) Instruction
3. A field of study
4. Training that creates, molds or perfects the mental faculties or moral character
5. a: A control gained by enforcing obedience or order
b: orderly or prescribed conduct or pattern of behavior
c: self-control
6. A rule or system of rules governing conduct or activity

As a verb-
1. To punish or penalize for the sake of enforcing obedience and perfecting moral character.
2. To train or develop by instruction and exercise especially in self-control.
3. a: To bring under control
b: To impose order upon

So yes, I feel my previous "definition" (Effective correction of disobedience...) of discipline is accurate. And you are right, parentastic, that it is a learner-mentor relationship which is exactly why in the very few times that behavioral correction in our home has resulted in a spanking, said spanking is always preceded and followed by confirmation that she understands why she is receiving one. I think we can agree that you and I will never share the same views on spanking... and I did not start this thread to be persuaded whether or not it is wrong. We all have that decision to make for ourselves!

I never said our discipline has been ineffective.
* She lies, she is given a chance to tell the truth.
* Choosing not to tell the truth results in grounding from whatever is most important at the time... and then given another chance to be truthful. Most of the time it ends here and we reinforce why being truthful is important, etc.
* Should she continue to hold on to the lie, DH administers a spanking.

She is always given a choice when possible - the choice to change her behavior or receive a consequence. We've even let her choose a punishment a few times i.e. "If you don't stop arguing, you can either lose your Nintendo DS for the next week or you can miss your slumber party."

We've only gotten to the spanking stage once with the lying issue. The next time she chose to confess. I'd say that knowing we're serious and her desire to not receive spanking as a consequence worked. Being disrespectful - we take the same approach with varying degrees of punishment. It works for us and we honestly do not have many behavioral problems.

I'm going to just let the rest of that argumentative post go because I could rebut each point but don't have the time or desire b/c we will never agree on this, much of what I said was misconstrued and I'm not here to ARGUE. However, I could debate your opinion on animals all night but that's not what we are here for. My dogs understand what "get off the couch" means and they obey. They are most certainly capable of learning. Don't get me started on my parrots. Not all animals react with a simple fight/flight response. End of that little goose chase. I knew that would be misinterpreted as well.

Bottom line, I came here for some constructive ideas, not a debate on how each of us chooses to discipline in our homes and who is right or wrong. I don't admonish anyone for choosing NOT to spank their kids... so thank you to those of you who chose to answer my questions rather than give me a tongue lashing!!

 

[TabascoNatalie]

BM is one of the most manipulative people I've had the displeasure of knowing and drags her child into her dislike for both DH and I. So K thinks she can use the "my mommy said you can't spank me" excuse when she's in trouble and doesn't like the upcoming consequence, regardless of what it is. Does that make sense?

If she is so manipulative and bitter, she may land you in trouble for being abusive. If you deliberately choose to spank, you are giving her a weapon against you.

 

[MomoJA]

Like I said in the other thread. I have no problem with a swat to the butt. My stance to you was that the bio-mom said that she did not want you spanking her child...regardless of whether or not she does. As long as she is the custodial parent, I feel that her wants should be 'respected'..

I agree with M2M on this point. I do not spank my child. I was spanked and I was NOT abused. And if I were not there to discipline my child, I would not be horrified if my parents spanked her, my brothers, sisters, cousins, best friend. If I trusted any woman her father ever were to marry; if I knew that woman loved my child and if spanking were not the only form of discipline but was part of her way of disciplining, I would not be horrified if she spanked my child. But if I did not know that woman well enough to trust her, I would not want her spanking my child nor imparting a long list of disciplining techniques, (I'd expect her to be disciplined, but much in the way a teacher would discipline her) and I think I would contrive for her never to visit if I knew the stepmom were going against my wishes.

 

[Mom2all]

txstepmom welcome to the parents forum! Let me start by saying that you should first know that there are those on here that are quick to judge any parent who spanks as abusive. I am not of that opinion. I spanked my children when they were young for things I deemed dangerous to them. ( Going to the pool without asking, going near the roadway, playing with a lighter, etc. ) It was for things that I needed an immediate compliance. One warning, then a spanking. Only one of those, (the pool) required a 3rd response from me. So I feel like in the case where safety is an issue, I'd rather hurt the butt and get an immediate attention.

That being said, in your situation, I think some changes could be made. I'd first like to say, I hate the word "step" added to parent. I think if you love and raise a child, you are just a parent. The problem I see with your situation is that she is only with you for a little while every other week and the fact she is 10. You and her father are not going to be able to change anything about her daily life in the little amount of time you have her if her other parents are on a different page than you. Sadly, her mother hating you and your child being subjected to hearing the arguments is so wrong and very confusing for her. That is not her fault. That whole situation is a hot mess.

I'd change the way I interacted with her altogether. One, I'd let her know I understood her. Chances are she is defiant because her world is confusing. Tell her that she can call you what ever she feels safe to call you. You like being her other Mom, but its not worth her getting in trouble for. That is a small thing after all. Its just a title, kind of like "step" and its meaningless really.

And as for the spanking, I wouldn't if I were you. Not because I believe it causes scars that never heal on our children, but because in your situation you'd most likely being doing the opposite of what your intending. Her Mom calls you a monster, the child misbehaves, and you spank, and her 3 days with you every other weekend is colored with a spanking that re-enforces what her Mom told her about you.

Would I discipline her, yes! But it would be in a way she understood was her own choosing. "I'd love to have a great time this weekend. We have so many fun things planned and we've missed you. BUT, if you treat me badly or if you don't listen, I can't do these things and we both with miss out" If she shows her butt, send her to her room. Simply, "I don't treat you that way, your not going to treat me that way"

 

[txstepmom]

A few things - #1 She can't revoke visitation without a court order. My husband and I both welcome BM to take us to court for any matter she wishes. She won't do it b/c she'll lose. She won't do anything formal to bring light to what happens in her own home: drunken, mean husband who is in and out of jail as well as their home, leaving her children home alone after school on a regular basis with no form of communication. The list goes on and has compiled for years. We haven't had the money to take HER to court or we would have by now. If she was going to instigate that she would have by now. I've spanked K all of 3 times. DH has handled it the other times.

#2 - BM doesn't think ANYbody has the *right* to discipline HER child. Well, that kind of attitude sets K up to walk a rough path in life. I see the results of that kind of child-rearing every day working with high school kids. We're doing our best to give her stability she does not have with her mother... and help raise a respectful, thoughtful, honest and kind young lady and no discipline we use is done in anger.

#3 - BM knows I'd never harm her child. We know she doesn't consider spanking harm b/c she does it herself. Her beef with me revolves around her own insecurities and fear that she'll "lose" her daughter to another woman. She lashes out over fingernail polish color or if K wants ME to take her for a haircut! The woman has problems and when she's taking her meds she is fairly rational. When she isn't, look out everybody!

M2M, I hate the whole "step" thing, too. When I talk about her, she's my daughter (and not b/c I'm trying to replace her mother). The situation is definitely a hot mess. Fortunately, I'm good at controlling my temper and she doesn't hear negativity about her BM from me, ever. BM is just shooting herself in the foot with that foolishness and K sees it. Breaks my heart for a 10 year old to have to deal with it.

We've never taken issue with what she calls me as long as she is respectful. She was 3 when I came into her life and started with Miss Leslie. SHE started saying Mommy Leslie a couple years later and has since dropped my 1st name out of it. That threatens and infuriates her BM and sadly, K has adjusted to using my 1st name when she is with BM b/c BM won't allow anything else. It's so sad.

Fortunately when we have her on longer school breaks, everything goes remarkably well. She falls easily into our routines. We hope and pray that in the not so distant future we'll be able to change the custody arrangement.

 

[mom2many]

Your biggest hurdle is the fact that your time is limited with her and the fact that 2 households and 2 set's of rules. I believe if you are always consistent (hence the rules compact) she will be able to fall in line with your rules easier.

 

[MomoJA]

I completely understand the attitude you describe with regard to "my mother says you can't" and that is extremely detrimental to the child. And I can see it isn't even about the spanking in this case. Anything you did would result in the same outcome. It is unfortunate.

I hope for your daughter's sake that you are able to build that relationship with her I would want my child to have with her stepmom if she ever has one.

I still believe that as her mother, I should have some say in who spanks her or uses other forms of discipline other than the basic "time outs," etc. That is not to say that I don't see your dilemma and the impossible situation the bio mom has created. I trust your assessment that it is basically a manipulation tactic, but I still cannot concede this point from a my perspective.

It sounds like you do not yet have the relationship with your daughter that would make me comfortable with you spanking her if I were her mom. I know that is not your fault and you are fighting an uphill battle, but I think you have to first focus on developing that relationship.

I think once you do that, your daughter will realize that her life with you is more safe and stable than at her mom's and she will not be as defiant as she is bound to be in her situation.

 

[parentastic]

I think we can agree that you and I will never share the same views on spanking...

Yes, I think we can agree on that
But even with our differences and how we see discipline in a very different way, I can totally relate when you ask this:

do you expect the biological parent to handle all discipline and leave the step parent out of it? do you agree with that step parent disciplining your child when necessary?

I have been in a position of step parent in two different relationship, and the bottom line is, yes, your role is the same as a parent. You should have your husband's full trust here.

Your presence in this child's life is just as significant for her than if you would be a biological mother. Developmentally speaking, there is no difference. What you say, what you do, how you say or do it, how you care for her, how you help her or teach her - it matters tremendously, and it matters to her developing mind as much as what her bio mom does or what her bio dad, your husband, says or does.
Regardless of how you choose to discipline her, or the parenting style you decided to take, it's your duty and responsibility as soon as your are involved on a daily basis with a child, whether the bio mom likes it or not.

Of course, the <I>how</I> this is done can be discussed. But letting the child live around you with no guidance and nothing to say about it can only be detrimental for her on the long run, not to mention the strange power dynamics it creates in the family.

 

[Xero]

I will have to agree with Parentastic and M2M on this one.

I am just having a hard time understanding why someone who only sees a child every other weekend would ever feel the need to escalate a punishment to the point of getting physical?

I think that only having K 2 nights/every other weekend really hinders any kind of routine and really limits the discipline strategies that would potentially work. So I'm open to ideas!

I just feel like if I only saw my step child a few days a month, there would just be no need for spankings. The poor thing obviously gets enough of that crap when she's at home (a belt?!), why add to it? Is she that hard to deal with? Mind you, I am not "against" occasional spanking (don't do it myself, but I know people that do and their kids are fine) or anything, but I just don't see how it is warranted in your situation. How hard can it be to get through two days every couple of weeks without hitting your step kid? I'm sorry if that comes off as offensive, I guess I'm just boggled right now. Anyway, I also have to agree that if one of the biological parents doesn't feel comfortable with you spanking, that you shouldn't. I don't consider myself crazy or vindictive, and I feel that if my husband and I were separated that I would not ever be comfortable with his spouse physically punishing my children in any way. I mean, even if the girl is using it as a playing card, you are the one that is letting her do that because you let it bother you. It really doesn't matter. There's no need to stoop to the argumentative level of a ten year old. So what if she says you can't spank her? Really, you could correct her by saying that you choose not to. Problem solved. Then you don't feel the need to spank her to prove her wrong / ...?), and you still get to keep your pride. Win/win.

I guess I could kind of see a struggle with trying not to spank her if you had like 50/50 custody or something, but you barely see her. What's the problem?

Again, I'm not playing the "spanking is evil, harmful, and emotionally crushing" card. I just don't understand why you find it necessary in the short amount of time you spend with her. And honestly, you say you wish to spank to teach a lesson, but you didn't spank when she crossed the road without looking both ways, you spanked when she through a fit. Spanking at a time like that is just a reaction stemming from your own anger. That kind of spanking happens when you are mad at the child and you want them to stop. I just don't see why it's so hard to find other approaches and solutions when you only see her for two days every other week.

 

[bssage]

I have been in a position of step parent in two different relationship.

what you're saying is it some point you had 2 girlfriends with kids. is that a correct assumption ?