Mad dad.....

[MomoJA]

First of all, yes it is nothing. It happens oh so often that it became nothing. And not only among teens, but among all humans in general. It is rude, yes, but it happens so why making such a big deal out of it? !

Make a bid deal out of it because it is rude. Make a big deal out of it because you hold your child to higher standards than that.

It happens that children shoplift. It happens that teenagers drive drunk. It happens that 12 year olds have sex. It happens that people lie, cheat, and steal. Why make a big deal about those things?

As for the point of the video, it was not for you or me or those millions of people who have reported him to child services or called him an idiot and said what a bad parent he is (yes, millions of people agree with you and that's what I find scary) and it wasn't for the millions of people who are applauding him. It was for his daughter and her original audience. And it was for him.

Did he go overboard? Yes. Did he do anything dangerous or damaging? No. Could he have handled it better? Yes. Could he have handled it worse? Yes. Could he have ignored it? Yes. Should he have ignored it? No.

 

[singledad]

We can NOT let what is normal for the times dictate what we allow. What parents are allowing becomes what is normal for the times. ITS OUR JOB TO STOP IT!

^^^ That ^^^

First of all, yes it is nothing. It happens oh so often that it became nothing. And not only among teens, but among all humans in general. It is rude, yes, but it happens so why making such a big deal out of it? It still does not explain the point of the video.

I'm, sorry, but I don't agree with this at all.

I think the fundamental difference here is that many of us don't believe that something should be allowed just because its the norm. I believe that the more prevalent a "wrong" becomes, the more important it becomes for us, as parents, to teach our children that it is absolutely not right.

I also don't believe in excuses. Excuses is just a way to dodge responsibility. Saying she was angry, or that she forgot that facebook is public, isn't good enough. She has made that mistake before, got corrected, and then went ahead and did it again. And in the process, she hurt her parents deeply.

We need to teach our kids to think before they speak/post, even when they're angry. ESPECIALLY when they're angry. Because those things we say in anger hurt other people, and destroy relationships, marriages and careers.

Also, people have been fired for ranting against their employers on facebook. People have been criminally charged for things they post on facebook. People have committed suicide because of what other people post on facebook. <U>What you post on facebook matters</U>.

This girl is fortunate to have learnt this lesson from her dad, and not in some other, much harder way.

I know it seems that everyone is teaming up against you here - I don't think its anyone's intention. I think we just have a fundamental disagreement about exactly how serious what the girl did is, and how far a parent should stretch his own moral compass to allow for what is "the norm".

 

[TabascoNatalie]

also don't believe in excuses. Excuses is just a way to dodge responsibility. Saying she was angry, or that she forgot that facebook is public, isn't good enough. She has made that mistake before, got corrected, and then went ahead and did it again. And in the process, she hurt her parents deeply.

whining about her chores to her friends online, IMO, is not such a thing for a parent to be "deeply hurt" about. If it is, I asume, she must be a really very good child.

as for facebook... i wonder what this guy's reaction would have been, if she had said it to him personally.

 

[MomoJA]

whining about her chores to her friends online, IMO, is not such a thing for a parent to be "deeply hurt" about. If it is, I asume, she must be a really very good child.

as for facebook... i wonder what this guy's reaction would have been, if she had said it to him personally.

I don't know if you watched the video. It was more than whining about chores.

Apparently, according to the update M2M posted, she IS a really good kid. It seems he has done something right. Probably one of those things is that he doesn't accept the excuse that everyone else's kids are rude, disrespectful, ungrateful brats, so that's good enough for his kids.

I just cannot see how shrugging your shoulders and saying, "kids will be kids" about this can be considered good parenting. The reason we have such slackers and ingrates today is because of this sort parenting. I think it is laziness and a form of selfishness to not take the trouble to correct this sort of behavior just because the norm has so sadly deteriorated this way.

I don't think his reaction was the best one, but it was better than ignoring the behavior and it seems to have worked for his family.

I can't speak for how he would have reacted if she had said it to his face, but if my child spoke to me in the tone she took in her rant, that would be a major issue for me. However, I would think it much more mature and appropriate if she had a complaint about me to take it to me, not to some public and permanent forum. But more importantly, I would not want her to say it on facebook because it could come back to hurt HER, and my job is to protect her, not let her do something stupid because it is "normal" and not a big deal in a lot of people's minds.

 

[TabascoNatalie]

what she did was stupid. childish.
the way he chose to respond... mature? not very

 

[Mom2all]

I think for me what stood out about the whole thing was this...

The only cursing he did was in reading his daughters letter. His words were that she disrespected the lady who cleaned their house, ( someone who works harder than she ever has to support her family). She was disrespectful to him, her step mother, and mother. He couldn't believe she would say those things and he could not express how disappointed he was. She would be earning her own things now and not given them because she didn't appreciate that she had an easy life, and that she had exaggerated her hard existence. He's stated he put in on her facebook to show her and the friends that had posted how cool it was that with rants like that about the people in her life were disrespectful the consequences were bad. And that her was doing this because grounding her obviously didn't work. But he never belittled her, just her actions there. He wasn't trying to be a super star, as evidenced in his refusal to be interviewed by hundreds of TV stations, stating that he posted that there for his daughter and her or him gaining money defeated the purpose of punishment. I seen a Dad who had talked with her Mom and planned a punishment that he thought would teach his daughter a lesson. I did not see a angry Dad trying to gain notoriety or make himself a super star or one acting out in an angry childish way. Had he punched her in the face when she got home from school and kicked her out.. that would have been acting in anger, and that unfortunately happens everyday. And we wouldn't even know about it to be here debating it.

I went to his facebook page. The only thing he appears to be using his 15 minutes of fame for is to encourage people who come there not to send him e-mail..and to turn down interviews and make people aware that his video has a copy write and not to re-post it, but to visit a Muscular Dystrophy Association donation page and make their interest in his life count for something good. I like the guy. :takeabow:

 

[NancyM]

Wow you know, you didn't have to respond to every single thing I said, because I will just disagree with you on every single point.

First of all, yes it is nothing. It happens oh so often that it became nothing. And not only among teens, but among all humans in general. It is rude, yes, but it happens so why making such a big deal out of it? It still does not explain the point of the video.

But I will agree with you. The gun is what bothers me the most. So I will stop with that. X)

You know what bothers me the most here? Besides the gun, the fact that he did a video and everyone is agreeing with him. That is all. He is acting as if his teen is one of a kind. What she did is nothing surprising. She just said a bunch of inappropriate things out of anger on her Facebook page. I am sorry but when you write on Facebook something, you forget about the fact that anyone can see it. It's not like she said it in front of a camera and posted it online, like her father!

That's what bothered me too. It's like she's the only teen who ever disrespected anyone. I understand the father's anger at her, and I'm not saying I wouldn't have gotten mad too. I can definatly say that I never ever would have thought to take out my gun and shoot his computer or electronic game, or any toy. Either would my husband.

Some people keep saying 'But she was told many times and still didn't listen' again, that's what teens do they push you over the edge. So. take her computer away until she stops doing what you don't like. No time limit, make her come for it once she has stopped her undesirable behavior. But to 'kill' it?? I still find that bazaar. Sorry.

However, I still think teenagers need their private space just to be teenagers. REMEMBER HOW THAT WAS EVERYONE??? When we didn't want our parents to be seen with us. HONESTLY? We parents shouldn't know every single thing our normal teen is doing either.

I remember how it was when I was a teen, I rebelled just as well as any other teenager. My parents gave us a lot of respect, and allowed us to be teenagers without watching and controlling our every single move and breath. They just let us be our age, and yes we got in trouble for being rude and disrespectful too.

Our diaries were sacred ,if parents wanted to, they could have found just about all the same stuff this kid wrote on FB in our diaries, We talked about our families, friends, boyfriends, school, our deepest feelings, and all kinds of secrets. They respected our rights as people and if they did read our diaries they pretty much kept that to themselves. Teenagers haven't changed, technology has.

I suppose not everyone had that kind of loving safe upbringing, and maybe that's why many people think the father's reaction wasn't so over the top. Sad but I guess that has a lot to do with it.

 

[MomoJA]

That's what bothered me too. It's like she's the only teen who ever disrespected anyone. .

She's his only teen who has been so disrespectful. I don't think parents parent by comparing their kids to other kids and saying all the other kids are doing this, so I guess it's okay that mine does it too.

Our diaries were sacred ,if parents wanted to, they could have found just about all the same stuff this kid wrote on FB in our diaries, We talked about our families, friends, boyfriends, school, our deepest feelings, and all kinds of secrets. They respected our rights as people and if they did read our diaries they pretty much kept that to themselves. Teenagers haven't changed, technology has. .

Did you bring your diary to school and pass it around for everyone to read? Did you write really hateful things about your parents and pass that around for everyone to see. If so, what were you trying to accomplish? That's the difference between a diary and facebook. Diaries still exist. Teenagers still keep diaries. They don't put the same things in their diaries that they put on facebook. If she had written that kind of garbage in her diary, we wouldn't be discussing this today.

I suppose not everyone had that kind of loving safe upbringing, and maybe that's why many people think the father's reaction wasn't so over the top. Sad but I guess that has a lot to do with it.

Interesting. I see it the total opposite. I would never have been so rude and disrespectful. NEVER. And not because I was afraid of what my parents would do, but because it was crass, uncouth, and would have reflected badly on my family. Where I come from, we have a lot of family pride . . . I guess because we feel loved and safe in our families.

The people I would have expected that sort of behavior from were from obviously dysfunctional families. Those kids didn't have the standards of behavior that we had where I came from, and I think that's part of why so many people support this guy. They expect that a kid with that sort of disrespectful attitude probably has parents who don't really think disrespect is such a bad thing, and so they are to be blamed for that sort of behavior from their children. This guy obviously had the standards for respectful behavior that we also value.

 

[NancyM]

MomoJA[/B]]She's his only teen who has been so disrespectful. I don't think parents parent by comparing their kids to other kids and saying all the other kids are doing this, so I guess it's okay that mine does it too.

Not necessarily, although I didn't mind seeking advice from others when I wasn't sure about some particular behavior my son was going through, but in my previous post I'm expressing my opinion why parents might first consider talking to someone about their teenager, and asking if what theirs is doing is somewhat normal or do they need to get their child psychological help. There are such things as parenting classes or meetings where parents group together and talk about their kids and it's geared specifically for parents who are dumbfounded about a stage of development their child is going through. Short: perhaps the parents in this case would have benefited by seeking professional help, or joining a parenting class because his daughter was so uncontrollable in his opinion.

Quote from Momoja:
Did you bring your diary to school and pass it around for everyone to read? Did you write really hateful things about your parents and pass that around for everyone to see. If so, what were you trying to accomplish? That's the difference between a diary and facebook. Diaries still exist. Teenagers still keep diaries. They don't put the same things in their diaries that they put on facebook. If she had written that kind of garbage in her diary, we wouldn't be discussing this today.

I'm not afraid to be honest, yes sometimes I did say hateful things about my parents, I didn't mean those things, but I was unskilled in expressing my feelings during my adolescence,and acted out instead of verbalizing, not to mention hormonal and many times angry at them for no reason at all.
I don't remember bringing my diary to school , but the times were different, we didn't do that with diaries, doesn't mean I didn't tell my BFF what I thought about my parents or what ever problems I was experiencing at that time.

Quote by Momoja
Interesting. I see it the total opposite. I would never have been so rude and disrespectful. NEVER. And not because I was afraid of what my parents would do, but because it was crass, uncouth, and would have reflected badly on my family. Where I come from, we have a lot of family pride . . . I guess because we feel loved and safe in our families.

The people I would have expected that sort of behavior from were from obviously dysfunctional families. Those kids didn't have the standards of behavior that we had where I came from, and I think that's part of why so many people support this guy. They expect that a kid with that sort of disrespectful attitude probably has parents who don't really think disrespect is such a bad thing, and so they are to be blamed for that sort of behavior from their children. This guy obviously had the standards for respectful behavior that we also value.

That's wonderful. Your parents were very lucky to have a kid like you who gave them no trouble through her teen age years.


It is interesting, dysfunction is normal in all families so many personalities and age differences, it's the degree of dysfunction that makes the difference.(or causes alarm) I know mine is dysfunctional to a point, crazy in laws and that sort of thing. No family is perfect.

I don't want to blame that sort of behavior on dysfunction, when in my opinion it's something as simple as teen age maturity or immaturity, I think saying only dysfunctional teens would act this way actually gives the kid an easier way out. (can blame the family)

As for (you) not ever being so rude or disrespectful, I thought that about myself as well, until one of my older siblings told me how I actually acted during certain times of my young life lol I was surprised to find out certain things about myself that I simply forgot or didn't want to think I could possible do or say those things. Don't forget we're looking back at ourselfs today, thinking as mature adults, where as than we were immature growing people who didn't have the same knowledge or sense about life that we have today.

Anyway have a great day.

 

[NancyM]

Sorry about the format of above post I'm still working on quoting others posts. hope it makes sense.

 

[Mom2all]

I agree. Growing up, I was encouraged to be my best. We weren't allowed to say "can't", ( because according to my Dad that word didn't exist) I could do anything I set my mind to. My Dad raised my sister and I alone, and he made sure that we knew we were just as capable as anyone else to be great. I could be a doctor, I could water ski, I could hike the AT with nothing but my back pack and a stick, and I could beat him in a game of one one one if I cared to practice enough.

We also knew our boundaries. I had to use words like, Mam' and sir, please, thank you, and I'm sorry when it called for it. I waited until the right time to talk.. definitely didn't interrupt adults. Our elderly people were always served dinner first with children waiting at the end and we cleaned the dishes. If my grandparents were working outside and we didn't stop to offer help.. oh my! We carried wood, had chores to do, and were taught to "hustle". To my Dad that was to walk with a purpose... not drag my butt when I'm supposed to being doing something.

He cut the cord to the TV and threw my Atari out the door when we didn't do our chores for using them.

When other adults started using vulgarities... my Dad would ask them to watch their mouth in front of us. His arms held me when I cried. He held my hand when we crossed the road. He cried with pride when I sang in front of people. He met my boyfriends outside to explain how important I was. He went to teacher conferences.

I came from a loving and safe home. But I still knew to mind my manners... and I did. If my Dad had of caught me saying something rude about him to anyone... I would have been mortified. And if memory serves me correctly.. the worst I said was that he was old fashioned and that he had no sense of style with his clothes. And I would have whispered that in the ears of my sister or best friend.

 

[Mom2all]

As an afterthought.. My 15 year old DD last night was telling us that she had learned about joints in the human body in school and preceded to tell us about them. At one point saying the hip is not a ball and socket, but a hinge joint, different from the shoulder. I told her I believed that was wrong. She looked at me, and for about 30 seconds I could see in her face that she believed me to be a complete and udder idiot. She did not roll her eyes or say it, but I felt it none the less. She left the conversation and decided to "clean her room". At dinner last night, I brought up ways appropriate ways to debate a fact and prove your theory. None of them included silence, irritation, or walking out. Afterward, when she debated with me again about the sockets, she came and looked it up to prove me wrong. She did it with a smile (even when she found out she was in fact wrong). She is a child who needs me to teach her to control her emotions, mouth and all around way of reacting.

All that for this...
Had she not decided on her own to re-do the behavior in a better way, I would have insisted on the next time. Perhaps with a essay with references.

Behavior I do not like= what ever it takes to correct it.
Its because I love her enough to take time to do it.

PS. Sorry I find myself writing novels on here!

 

[IADad]

While I agree with him taking a stand and trying to teach her a lesson, there are two things that bother me. It seems harsh and intended to be hurtful. Not a very adult thing to be. Second, what lesson does it really teach? I'm your dad and I can wreck your stuff?

Let's take another scenario. Seeing that this is obviously a gun loving dad, and absolutely nothing wrong with that at all, I'm guessing maybe he has taught his daughter to shoot. Now, let's say he caught her being irresponsible with a gun? What would he have done? I'm guessing he wouldn't have shot her gun (okay, that was supposed to be a joke, flashing back to that scene in "Survivors") or melted it down in a forge...he would have taken it away from her, lectured her, maybe given her other punishments to teach her to be responsible. I don't think this taught anything other than "I gotta hide stuff better from dad."

 

[EnoMae]

Very funny parody
This video is enough to explain how ridiculous the original one was.
http://youtu.be/53lb5hXYGxQ

 

[EnoMae]

I suppose not everyone had that kind of loving safe upbringing, and maybe that's why many people think the father's reaction wasn't so over the top. Sad but I guess that has a lot to do with it.

Very well said

 

[mom2many]

That's what bothered me too. It's like she's the only teen who ever disrespected anyone. I understand the father's anger at her, and I'm not saying I wouldn't have gotten mad too. I can definatly say that I never ever would have thought to take out my gun and shoot his computer or electronic game, or any toy. Either would my husband.

Oh I have but for a completely different reason!

Some people keep saying 'But she was told many times and still didn't listen' again, that's what teens do they push you over the edge. So. take her computer away until she stops doing what you don't like. No time limit, make her come for it once she has stopped her undesirable behavior. But to 'kill' it?? I still find that bazaar. Sorry.

I think dad was just at the point that he was trying to make a much bigger lasting impression. While I find shooting it overkill also. I didn't/don't see it as that big of a deal.

However, I still think teenagers need their private space just to be teenagers. REMEMBER HOW THAT WAS EVERYONE??? When we didn't want our parents to be seen with us. HONESTLY? We parents shouldn't know every single thing our normal teen is doing either.

I'm not so sure that we shouldn't know at least 90% of what our teens are doing. This wasn't a diary, it was FB...very viral and very public. If she didn't want there to be any chance that her parents would see it then she should not have posted it on the internet. Even a 16 year old is capable of understanding that.

I remember how it was when I was a teen, I rebelled just as well as any other teenager. My parents gave us a lot of respect, and allowed us to be teenagers without watching and controlling our every single move and breath. They just let us be our age, and yes we got in trouble for being rude and disrespectful too.

I never rebelled, sad but true, I was a really good kid. I always told my mom when I was going to ditch. I always called when going from one place to another. I would NEVER think to write the kinda letter she did. My very own teenagers said that it was disrespectful of her not to mention degrading to the house lady. They...teenagers themselves, saw absolutely nothing wrong with what the dad did. They said they could see me doing it if they pushed me to far. I wouldn't have used a gun, my luck the recoil would have hit me in the head.


Our diaries were sacred ,if parents wanted to, they could have found just about all the same stuff this kid wrote on FB in our diaries, We talked about our families, friends, boyfriends, school, our deepest feelings, and all kinds of secrets. They respected our rights as people and if they did read our diaries they pretty much kept that to themselves. Teenagers haven't changed, technology has.

True, but that means they are a lot more smarter at it the most parents are and it doesn't take common sense (well not a lot) to know if you want something private facebook is not the place to put it. Megan just made a good point also...you wouldn't take your diary to school and let them read it. That's what facebook is like, if you don't want it known you don't post it.

I suppose not everyone had that kind of loving safe upbringing, and maybe that's why many people think the father's reaction wasn't so over the top. Sad but I guess that has a lot to do with it.

I don;t see that. I don't think she has unloving carefree life. I think her parents have rules that she is required to live by, a moral code that the parents live by. I had (outside of abuse and many other things) a really good childhood and I don't see it as that over the top.

....

 

[mom2many]

Very funny parody
This video is enough to explain how ridiculous the original one was.
http://youtu.be/53lb5hXYGxQ

That was funny. Still doesn't change my opinion though.:spinny:

 

[parentastic]

Article: Why you shouldn't shoot your daughter's laptop.

 

[mom2many]

&lt;r&gt;&lt;QUOTE author="parentastic;130593"&gt;&lt;s&gt;

&lt;/s&gt;Article: &lt;URL url="&lt;/s&gt;Why you shouldn't shoot your daughter's laptop&lt;e&gt;&lt;/e&gt;&lt;/URL&gt;.&lt;e&gt;

&lt;/e&gt;&lt;/QUOTE&gt;

From the article..&lt;br/&gt;

&lt;QUOTE&gt;&lt;s&gt;

&lt;/s&gt;According to a new study, authoritarian parents—“my way or the highway” or “fire a round of ammo into your laptop if you disobey me” style—are more likely to raise delinquent children than caring, respectful parents. Why? Researchers believe that socializing with your kids makes them more likely to follow your rules. In a no-room-to-move household, kids don’t get the same kind of socialization that nurturing parents give, leading them to rebel.&lt;e&gt;

&lt;/e&gt;&lt;/QUOTE&gt;

There is a difference between parents who control every aspect of a child's life, dictatorship, and parents who hold the authority. I hold the authority in my house, don't like it, leave. We do have a very open relationship. What I really hate is that research only ever looks at one extreme or another. Rarely do they look at parents who walk the middle ground. I can say that I have seen kids that come from household, just like described, who have children that are the exact same way.&lt;br/&gt;

&lt;QUOTE&gt;&lt;s&gt;

&lt;/s&gt;
#1: Act Like An Adult, Not a Boy With A Gun&lt;br/&gt;
Know this: Your kid is going to act like a kid. The question is, how old are you going to act? This should have been a wake-up call, not a call to arms, says Runkel. You can’t act like a mad child with a gun and wonder why your kids don’t respect you. When you do something that explosive, your child doesn’t focus on their behavior, they focus on what a reactive jerk their dad is.&lt;br/&gt;
&lt;br/&gt;
Don’t shoot the computer. Instead, let your child know how upset their behavior made you and why you think what they did was wrong, says Runkel. If you’re thrown for a loop about their actions, say these three magic words: “Tell me more.” See how you can help. This shows your kid you’re their teammate, not their (armed) enemy, says Runkel.&lt;e&gt;

&lt;/e&gt;&lt;/QUOTE&gt;

This would have been the better choice, I think even those who don't see it as wrong agree with that. However, parents are human also and sometimes they react in a way they believe is best. Is it always...no. &lt;br/&gt;

&lt;QUOTE&gt;&lt;s&gt;

&lt;/s&gt;“Failure is when we abandon what we want most for what we want right now,” says Runkel. That is, you shoot your kid’s laptop because you want them to shut up—just like you eat a whole pizza because you’re starving.&lt;br/&gt;
&lt;br/&gt;
What do you really want? For your kids to seek you out as a guide in life. “We love to put the blame on other people for our mistakes,” says Runkel. “That’s what this guy is doing. But if you listen to the daughter’s rant, the underlying message is that she’s crying out for better leadership from her parents.”&lt;br/&gt;
&lt;br/&gt;
Your son isn’t going to run down the stairs and say, I’ve been thinking, Dad—you really need to step up your game. He’s going to act out in class, roll his eyes—or post to Facebook. Notice these changes as a testament to your fatherhood. What message is he trying to send, and how can you change your behavior to change his? Keep your endgame in mind. (Check out this piece on how to Teach Your Kid Anything.)&lt;e&gt;

&lt;/e&gt;&lt;/QUOTE&gt;

Hogwash..that's all.&lt;br/&gt;

&lt;QUOTE&gt;&lt;s&gt;

&lt;/s&gt;#3: Communicate, Don’t Shoot Them Down&lt;br/&gt;
“The daughter here didn’t feel any way to express her frustration besides what she did,” says Runkel. Communication is clearly an issue, says Runkel.&lt;br/&gt;
&lt;br/&gt;
Truth is, lack of it can lead to bigger problems. A Brigham Young University study found strict parents more than doubled a teen’s risk of binge drinking—authoritative parents with a more nurturing style were the least likely to have boozers for kids. Your move: Set and explain negotiable boundaries. Make sure your daughter understands why her behavior makes you think she is not ready to have Facebook. Discuss an appropriate age for that rule to change. This keeps kids from going through great lengths to hide things, says Runkel&lt;e&gt;

&lt;/e&gt;&lt;/QUOTE&gt;. &lt;br/&gt;
&lt;br/&gt;
Truth is, that communication does not always work. I don't care if we are talking a teenager, toddler or grown adult. While communication is always they first step it isn't always enough.&lt;/r&gt;

 

[MomoJA]

Article: Why you shouldn't shoot your daughter's laptop.

I don't think Runkel has any clue as to what goes on in this family's house. He makes a lot of assumptions about them and then states that if you do A you get B.

Shoot a laptop, get blah, blah, blah. But do Runkel, Runkel, Runkel, and you get blah, blah, blah. Runkel, Runkel, Runkel is not bad, but humans don't work that way. Even mice don't work that way.

You can do Runkel, Runkel, Runkel better than Runkel can do it and still get the opposite of what he assumes he will get, and you can shoot a laptop and get better results than what Runkel thinks he will get.

Hmmm. I wonder why? Maybe because people aren't machines and parents sometimes know their own children, the contexts of their children's lives, and all the billions of influencing factors not taken into account by Runkel's "control experiment theory" better than Runkel ever can sitting in his desk inside his four walls.