Religious Discrimination...

[Dadu2004]

Religion and Faith is such a touchy topic. Everyone who believes in something thinks that what they believe in is correct and everyone else is wrong. Isn't that the nature of religion? If I were to say "I'm a Christian, but there's a possibility that my God is not the TRUE God", then I'm not being a Christian.

It's not that (again, speaking from a Christian perspective) we're judging anyone here. HW, I'm not judging you...but, if I'm a Christian, my belief tells me that you're wrong in your belief. That's the nature of faith. I believe strongly that Christ is my Lord and Savior and there is no other. Other "Gods" (or lack of) are incorrect. They are false. Therefore, your view of religion is incorrect. That's not judging, that's me standing behind my beliefs.

Now, if I said to you "You don't believe in Christ, therefore you are a horrible person", that would be judging you.

Unfortunately, sometimes it's best to agree to disagree and let it go.

 

[Dadu2004]

...and by the way HW...I don't think you're a horrible person.

 

[etceterae]

Wow. This is amazing; I hadn't expected so many people to reply and so quickly.

And you all are (for the most part) so non-judgemental! I suppose it's where I come from that's given me an awkward experience with overzealous faith. I live in the Bible Belt, after all. =]

I don't believe that I'm "lost" or have no goal because I'm an atheist. Is it necessary for a divine being to determine for me what I am to do for my life? I would rather choose my own path of my own volition and passions rather than have it spoken to me.

One more thing: and no offense, musicmom; I'm just going on something you touched upon =] It really bothers me when people say that they can simply ask for forgiveness when they die, and their deity will grant it to them. In that case, I don't see what holds people back from murdering without cause and thinking, "If I ask for forgiveness, it'll be okay."

A rational counter to this could be that one has to truly feel remorse and then ask for forgiveness for any deity to grant it. If so, then what if a person was killed in order to prevent him or her from doing something worse (blowing up a building)? The sin has not yet been committed by the imagined sinner, but the killer has taken matters into his or her own hands and prevented the sin from ever happening. The killer might not be able to feel remorse - after all, he or she just prevented something terrible from happening. But he or she also committed manslaughter without a tangible reason to (the supposed sin had not yet been committed). Thou shalt not kill. And there is no remorse. Can this person be granted forgiveness, in that case?

On a sidenote: OH MY GOODNESS! LAST DAY OF SCHOOL! I get to be in the 11th grade soon! So excited! So incoherent! XD

 

[Mindy]

I don't see how it is contradicting anything. I believe that the one way to heaven is through Jesus. You don't believe in Heaven so it doesn't matter. Many good people (deep inner good people that is) are not Christian. Do they live wonderful beautiful lives? Are htey happy? Do they give to the world in so many ways that we are better because they are around? Yes to all of them. BUT they will not spend eternity in Heaven. THey are still wonderful people and deserve respect in every way.

See, I wish I could rectify it in my mind to believe that as well, but I just can't... I cannot for the life of me believe, for one moment that a child living in the Jungle who has never known the word of Jesus, is not getting into Heaven. Nor do I believe a devout Buddhist Monk would not get into Heaven. That's what I just can't wrap my mind around. I don't believe the God I know and love is that judgmental. I think we messed up the wording in some of what he meant when the diciples were divinely inspired to pen "God's words"

LOL, rambling now But Kaytee, if you wouldn't mind sharing, I would love to know your thoughts on this

 

[Kaytee]

See, I wish I could rectify it in my mind to believe that as well, but I just can't... I cannot for the life of me believe, for one moment that a child living in the Jungle who has never known the word of Jesus, is not getting into Heaven. Nor do I believe a devout Buddhist Monk would not get into Heaven. That's what I just can't wrap my mind around. I don't believe the God I know and love is that judgmental. I think we messed up the wording in some of what he meant when the diciples were divinely inspired to pen "God's words"

LOL, rambling now But Kaytee, if you wouldn't mind sharing, I would love to know your thoughts on this

that is not how it works though. I had the same problem in thinking that way. People who are given the oppurtunity to let God lead the way, are the ones that are judged this way. This says it better then I can lol
BIBLE STUDY MANUALS: CHILDREN, DO THEY GO TO HEAVEN?

 

[etceterae]

I asked my said supah-Christian friend the same question, and he said, "Everybody has the word of Jesus imprinted in their hearts. It's something they will eventually recognize, and everybody innately knows it - no matter if they've seen a Bible before in their lives or not."

Is that just his denomination that thinks that?

 

[Skyburning]

In my personal experience the only people who are up in arms about religion being taught in the classroom, about our money having "In God we Trust" and so on are the ones that have no religion. Why do I as a Christian have to remain PC while others are allowed to do what they want?

I could care less about it saying that on the dollar, but I am one of the ones who believes religion should be left out of the classroom. Praying before class or at a football game or whatever is a-okay with me but a teacher in a classroom teaching religion as if it is fact bothers me, mainly because that is a subject for parents to handle at home, and I don't feel like explaining to my kid why I'm going to hell when I ask him how school was..:rollseyes: lol

 

[Mindy]

that is not how it works though. I had the same problem in thinking that way. People who are given the oppurtunity to let God lead the way, are the ones that are judged this way. This says it better then I can lol
BIBLE STUDY MANUALS: CHILDREN, DO THEY GO TO HEAVEN?

Thank you Kaytee, going to check that out!

 

[Mindy]

I asked my said supah-Christian friend the same question, and he said, "Everybody has the word of Jesus imprinted in their hearts. It's something they will eventually recognize, and everybody innately knows it - no matter if they've seen a Bible before in their lives or not."

Is that just his denomination that thinks that?

You see, then this leads me to believe that like I thought, there is only one God, but we just all call him something different

To me, he's ... energy. A supernatural force above me. Something beyond my understanding, But I don't deny "It's" existance I believe we have a Creator, I just don't believe it's what most think it is.

And as you can tell, I have a really hard time expressing what I really believe on the internet

 

[Good Wolf]

See, I wish I could rectify it in my mind to believe that as well, but I just can't... I cannot for the life of me believe, for one moment that a child living in the Jungle who has never known the word of Jesus, is not getting into Heaven. Nor do I believe a devout Buddhist Monk would not get into Heaven. That's what I just can't wrap my mind around. I don't believe the God I know and love is that judgmental. I think we messed up the wording in some of what he meant when the diciples were divinely inspired to pen "God's words"

LOL, rambling now But Kaytee, if you wouldn't mind sharing, I would love to know your thoughts on this

That is my exact thoughts on the matter, and I think it is morbid for someone to actually think anything else.

Here I go....

Religion was created as a form of government for those that do not fear the laws of man. It was created in order to obtain structure. Where did all the people who died go before Jesus, Abraham, or Mohamed walked the Earth? It had to have been Hades. If you say otherwise Zeus will strike you down with a lightning bolt! Ra will engorge you with the flames from the sun etc...

It is also a way for people to 'explain' everything. It gives answers to those that need them. It gives them something to get out of bed in the morning for. For some people it is too depressing to think that this life isn't a test, and that the pain, suffering, and self control that we experience and are forced to use is not in vain.

The only reason people practice religion is because they were taught it by the society they live in and they choose to believe in it. I refuse to believe that someone that is born in a different region from another person is going to 'hell' simply based on the prominent religion in their geographic location.

If 'that is the way it works' then count me out. If I'm wrong then I'm going to 'hell' with a hell of a lot of good people. If 'eternal bliss' is for those that want to believe that other people are going to 'hell' because they don't believe what they do even if they haven't been exposed to it then I don't want to be part of the lemming heard that marches through the 'golden gates'.

 

[Mindy]

That is my exact thoughts on the matter, and I think it is morbid for someone to actually think anything else.

Here I go....

Religion was created as a form of government for those that do not fear the laws of man. It was created in order to obtain structure. Where did all the people who died go before Jesus, Abraham, or Mohamed walked the Earth? It had to have been Hades. If you say otherwise Zeus will strike you down with a lightning bolt! Ra will engorge you with the flames from the sun etc...

It is also a way for people to 'explain' everything. It gives answers to those that need them. It gives them something to get out of bed in the morning for. For some people it is too depressing to think that this life isn't a test, and that the pain, suffering, and self control that we experience and are forced to use is not in vain.

The only reason people practice religion is because they were taught it by the society they live in and they choose to believe in it. I refuse to believe that someone that is born in a different region from another person is going to 'hell' simply based on the prominent religion in their geographic location.

If 'that is the way it works' then count me out. If I'm wrong then I'm going to 'hell' with a hell of a lot of good people. If 'eternal bliss' is for those that want to believe that other people are going to 'hell' because they don't believe what they do even if they haven't been exposed to it then I don't want to be part of the lemming heard that marches through the 'golden gates'. [/quote]

:award: :takeabow: *screams, "<I>we are not worthy, we are NOT worthy</I>"*

 

[Mindy]

I am completely religion-free, not even baptised, nor is my brother... When I wondered if Buddhists do go to "Heaven" though, I found this, thought I would share, it's interesting...

<SIZE size="100">Buddhism has a best heaven. Everything is just the way you want it to be. In this heaven, there is no reason to change anything. You are ultimately happy. The problem is that it's not permanent, as is everything in Buddhism. One day in the heaven realm is equal to 400 human years, and your stay is four thousand heaven years, so you will be there a really long time.
But, one day the karma that put you in this heaven will be used up. You are only in heaven as long as your Karma account has merit in it. You can only draw from your Karma account while in heaven, because there in no way to make a deposit. You can't practice generosity or compassion, and you're not striving to gain wisdom. When the karma that put you in heaven is used up... you're reborn... And that would probably make a lot of folks really unhappy. Who wants to leave a perfect place
</SIZE>

 

[Amber]

Ok, Hw...as for the priests molesting children...that is Catholicism. Totally different than Christianity. Please don't mistake the two. One worships Mary, the other, God.

No church that I've been to has every outlawed or condemned birth control. Sex is viewed as a source of reproduction...but ALSO as something to be enjoyed between a man and a woman who are married.

As for who is to say my beliefs are correct and others aren't? God did. Not me. Take it up with him.

I refuse to condemn anyone who doesn't believe the way I do. However, I will NOT miss a chance to talk about my Saviour, and I guess if that makes me politically uncorrect, then so be it. I've made no negative comments towards any religion, other than to say it's not the correct one. I don't believe they are. I also don't believe the sky is purple, but that's not a negative thing.

 

[Amber]

That is my exact thoughts on the matter, and I think it is morbid for someone to actually think anything else.

Here I go....

Religion was created as a form of government for those that do not fear the laws of man. It was created in order to obtain structure. Where did all the people who died go before Jesus, Abraham, or Mohamed walked the Earth? It had to have been Hades. If you say otherwise Zeus will strike you down with a lightning bolt! Ra will engorge you with the flames from the sun etc...

It is also a way for people to 'explain' everything. It gives answers to those that need them. It gives them something to get out of bed in the morning for. For some people it is too depressing to think that this life isn't a test, and that the pain, suffering, and self control that we experience and are forced to use is not in vain.

The only reason people practice religion is because they were taught it by the society they live in and they choose to believe in it. I refuse to believe that someone that is born in a different region from another person is going to 'hell' simply based on the prominent religion in their geographic location.

If 'that is the way it works' then count me out. If I'm wrong then I'm going to 'hell' with a hell of a lot of good people. If 'eternal bliss' is for those that want to believe that other people are going to 'hell' because they don't believe what they do even if they haven't been exposed to it then I don't want to be part of the lemming heard that marches through the 'golden gates'. [/quote]


The only thing I can say to this is...."religion" was around a lot longer than Jewish/American/Canadian whatever laws were ever thought of.

 

[Kaytee]

Ok, Hw...as for the priests molesting children...that is Catholicism. Totally different than Christianity. Please don't mistake the two. One worships Mary, the other, God.

I am not Catholic but this is an aweful thing to say. Catholics are Christian and do not worship Mary. I was raised Catholic and went to a Catholic school. We did not worship Mary by any means. They are a Christian sect, just as Protestant is a sect.

 

[Dadu2004]

Ok, Hw...as for the priests molesting children...that is Catholicism. Totally different than Christianity. Please don't mistake the two. One worships Mary, the other, God.

No church that I've been to has every outlawed or condemned birth control. Sex is viewed as a source of reproduction...but ALSO as something to be enjoyed between a man and a woman who are married.

As for who is to say my beliefs are correct and others aren't? God did. Not me. Take it up with him.

I refuse to condemn anyone who doesn't believe the way I do. However, I will NOT miss a chance to talk about my Saviour, and I guess if that makes me politically uncorrect, then so be it. I've made no negative comments towards any religion, other than to say it's not the correct one. I don't believe they are. I also don't believe the sky is purple, but that's not a negative thing.

I agree with you Amber, but have to correct you...I'm sorry.

1. Catholics don't worship Mary, but they're the only one's that pray to her. Catholicism is a form of Christianity...they worship God and Jesus as do we. The difference is they pray to Mary and saints.

2. Catholics don't believe in birth control, and it's against their decrees to use it.

I'm a recovered Catholic myself. :rollseyes:

 

[Amber]

See, I wish I could rectify it in my mind to believe that as well, but I just can't... I cannot for the life of me believe, for one moment that a child living in the Jungle who has never known the word of Jesus, is not getting into Heaven. Nor do I believe a devout Buddhist Monk would not get into Heaven. That's what I just can't wrap my mind around. I don't believe the God I know and love is that judgmental. I think we messed up the wording in some of what he meant when the diciples were divinely inspired to pen "God's words"

Children DO go to Heaven...so long as they're under the age of accountability. And before it's asked, there is no set age. It's whenever the child recognizes right from wrong, whenever conviction is placed upon their hearts.

Buddhist Monks....I'll have to do some research into what they believe and practice and get back to you on that one.

As for people living in remote places...that is what missionaries are for. And if, by chance (a very small, minute chance) someone has not heard the Word of God before they die, they cannot be held accountable for that. However, it's my belief everyone hears the Word of God at one point in their life, in one form or another.

 

[HappyMomma]

Actually, Catholics are Christians.

From my understanding they were the original Christians...

Protestant = Protesting the Catholic Church

 

[Kaytee]

I could care less about it saying that on the dollar, but I am one of the ones who believes religion should be left out of the classroom. Praying before class or at a football game or whatever is a-okay with me but a teacher in a classroom teaching religion as if it is fact bothers me, mainly because that is a subject for parents to handle at home, and I don't feel like explaining to my kid why I'm going to hell when I ask him how school was..:rollseyes: lol

I agree with you. I would not want a teacher of a public school to teach religion either. BUT it would not bother me in the least if they had a "religion" class. THa taught about other peoples way of thinking. I want my daughter to know about Judiasm and all the other many religions of the world.

 

[Amber]

I agree with you Amber, but have to correct you...I'm sorry.

1. Catholics don't worship Mary, but they're the only one's that pray to her. Catholicism is a form of Christianity...they worship God and Jesus as do we. The difference is they pray to Mary and saints.

2. Catholics don't believe in birth control, and it's against their decrees to use it.

I'm a recovered Catholic myself. :rollseyes:

Baptists DO believe in birth control.

As for the praying, it's essentially the same thing as worship, isn't it? I mean, we need no mediator to take our prayers to God. Jesus became our intercessor.